JJ's 818s Build

[07FIREBLADE]

Yes, I was able to do it on chassis #127. Now I'm switching out my springs and maybe bumping up to the R shocks soon. But it is definitely doing able just make sure your body and all aluminum is off and out of the way and have fun.

[TouchStone]

Quick update, installed swaybar and rear shock brace. Hopefully for the last time.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1502/24225217501_3a3e01e761_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/CUGzaP)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1696/24012136650_c0c6c4a908_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/CzStE3)

[TouchStone]

Finally, all the wires are gone!

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1715/24389311675_bf8fd94cf3_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/DacADH)

Anodized, not painted, louvers. I'm looking forward to seeing how they look once the panels are back on.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1563/24360374036_3037f615de_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/D7DhuU)

[nkw8181]

Looking great!

[TouchStone]

Finally got it out of my garage. Took it out for an alignment and tune. Now it spits fire! Engine changes since the last tune include:
ID1000
Walbro255
VF39 ported, clocked, new Char
3 port boost control
AWIC
AOS

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1570/24480630036_9b7ab828fa_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/DigCqd)

Before we put it on the dyno I realized the tires front & backs were reversed. I really wish I had this lift in my garage.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1560/23904079754_9839a0e1b3_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/CqjE77)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1451/24398532482_d2488c756c_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Db1RF9)

[TouchStone]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6it_LbTfuf4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzSknFByiG4

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1634/24506480846_7a50864d65_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Dky7XQ)

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Looks great Josh.
How much boost are you running?
Bob

[NISMO_RB25]

Man that is some Impressive numbers. I am only shooting for around 270/280HP.

[Tamra]

Nice!

[flynntuna]

Very nice indeed. Is it an optical illusion or did I see at about half way when the power was applied that the windshield started what looked like flexing back and forth for a few seconds?

[TouchStone]

Looks great Josh.
How much boost are you running?
Bob

I dont have an aftermarket sensor and I'm not sure how to read the logs, but the max value under "Manifold Relative Pressure (Corrected)(psi)" is 18.86psi.

https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=2FCE55C36EAEB9EA!180700&authkey=!AGfZtn5fNSduC_4&ithint=file%2ccsv

[TouchStone]

Very nice indeed. Is it an optical illusion or did I see at about half way when the power was applied that the windshield started what looked like flexing back and forth for a few seconds?

The windshield definitely shook a lot a some RPMs it will need to be fixed/reinforced somehow. Its bad enough that it moves the rear view mirror.

[Hindsight]

Ouch, I was worried about the same thing. The frame just doesn't seem very strong. Almost seems like it needs a bar in the center that ties into the top-center of the roll bar in the back (like a T-Top kind of setup). Might look dumb but aside from re-making the frame out of metal all the way around and making it very strong in the process, not sure what the other options would be.

[TouchStone]

I might contact a SmoothOn rep and see if they can recommend a cast-able foam. Invert the windshield and pour in a urethane foam, then clean up the overflow. If you get the right chemicals this stuff can be very strong, some are used to support electrical poles instead of concrete.

http://www.rainbowtech.net/products/view.php?cn=2877

http://www.smooth-on.com/Rigid-and-Flexible/c10/index.html

[metros]

Build is looking really good, especially the center console. Great job!

[TouchStone]

Getting ready for an autocross next weekend. Have to make sure I look the part!

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1687/24301910560_de1871b022_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/D2tDkW)

The stripes are temporary until I decide on the final color. It was also good practice on how NOT to vinyl wrap. They certainly dont pass the 5ft or even 10ft rule.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1616/24229678079_cb5219912b_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/CV6r9k)

[Tamra]

Well they look good from here! Good luck next weekend!

[TouchStone]

Very nice indeed. Is it an optical illusion or did I see at about half way when the power was applied that the windshield started what looked like flexing back and forth for a few seconds?

I figured out what you meant. I used YouTube's image stabilization on the video which made the windshield warp instead of just vibrate. I turned if off so it doesn't look so weird.

[ben1272]

Sorry if you explained this earlier in your thread, but what are you using for the shift linkage? Is it a custom control horn? It is definitely different from what I have in kit #352.

Great job on your build. Your car is looking really clean!

-Ben

[ben1272]

I think I get it now. The new shifter required reversing one of the motions on the shifter, thus custom horn mods? Nice job on all of the custom work....cutting, steel fab, welding, sheetmetal. All looks real nice.

[TouchStone]

I think I get it now. The new shifter required reversing one of the motions on the shifter, thus custom horn mods? Nice job on all of the custom work....cutting, steel fab, welding, sheetmetal. All looks real nice.

Thanks! The shifter is designed for an Acura RSX and needs the left/right motion reversed. I was originally going to use a bell crank (similar to Craig's design) to reduce cable bends but it was way easier to just weld on an additional tab to the FFR bracket. This setup feels ALOT better than FFR's shifter and mile long cables. You can see the brackets better in the following post. http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?16780-JJ-s-818s-Build&p=223396&viewfull=1#post223396

[Frank818]

Are you using mini latches from Quik-Latch?
If yes, what OD size?

[TouchStone]

Are you using mini latches from Quik-Latch?
If yes, what OD size?

Yes its from Quik-Latch partnumber QL-25-S.

The top is 1.25" and the hole to drill is 0.75"

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/qul-ql-25-s

If you want to use FFR mounting location you need the longer screws http://www.quik-latch.com/elongated-mini-quik-latch-pin.html

I instead fabricated offsets out of 1" square tube to allow the use of the standard screw and move the latch position closer to the corners of the hood. I don't have a picture of them installed (will post it later).

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1656/24598799631_9c79daba33_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/DtHh82)

[TouchStone]

All the changes I made to the engine and alignment since my first autocross made for a much more drive-able car. Still had a fair amount of spins but I was able to straighten it out and save some runs (huge improvement). I didn't realize till much later that during the straight-a-ways I was giving the car too much throttle.

Run 6 was my fastest time and in run 8 I went looking for the car's limit (fun!).


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7IsKrqHPBE My shifting is terrible, I know.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1665/24437300240_26d5d8e4b1_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/DerxYL)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1534/24105990983_6998843e59_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/CJavhc)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1505/24437299020_6e389abd18_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/DerxBJ)

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Great job Joshua. Way to beat the bugs out of the car.
I suspect you and your rider will ne a little sore tomorrow.

Your body role didn't look to bad, did you bump up the springs?
Where your tires spinning whenever I heard the rev limiter?

We do not see the rev limiter doing that on ours. Maybe because only 195 whp and 255 race comp rear tires..
Are you running more?

Keep diving the car hard and you will get quick hands every time the care thinks about stepping out.
Bob

[TouchStone]

Your body role didn't look to bad, did you bump up the springs?
Where your tires spinning whenever I heard the rev limiter?

We do not see the rev limiter doing that on ours. Maybe because only 195 whp and 255 race comp rear tires..
Are you running more?

Thanks it was an exciting day.

Changed springs in the rear to 550# and added the roll bar to the front.
The wheels were spinning through the entire straight causing the rev limiter to kick in. I know if I back off on the throttle a bit the car will accelerate faster but it was just too much fun. I have Potenza RE-11s (255 rear/235 front), they are an aggressive street tire and not as sticky as Proxes or Hoosier.

[nkw8181]

Looking good! you even got a bit of drifting in on the 8th lap :)

[TouchStone]

After sitting on my paperwork for about 2 weeks. I made the long journey of walking a couple blocks down the street from work to the county tax office and registered my 818. I was sort of expecting to deal with lots of questions and missing/incorrect paperwork, but no they only asked about the registration year (since I wrote 2015 by accident). In less than an hour I paid $465.75 and walked out with regular plates and a windshield sticker. This in addition to the vehicle and state inspection I paid just over $600 total to register!

[Hindsight]

Wow, congrats! Has to feel good to have that behind you.

[Frank818]

And TOUCHDOWN for Touchstone! :)

[nkw8181]

Woohoo! Now get those aluminum panels installed

[TouchStone]

Yes I've been putting off some of my build until it got registered.

Remaining items:

Finish aluminum panels, front and rear wheel wells
Rear mesh
Replace seats
finish center console
Interior carpet
Paint/vinyl wrap
Diagnose engine squeak - sounds like its related to the idle air control valve

[Sdrawkcab]

Very cool! Congrats on the TX registration.

(Nolan -- a couple weeks ago, enjoy seeing your car at Auto Science. Very nice.)

[nkw8181]

Thanks sdrawkcab! Hey Josh did you get your lights to shoot straight of do they still shoot down?

[TouchStone]

Thanks sdrawkcab! Hey Josh did you get your lights to shoot straight of do they still shoot down?

I haven't adjusted them.

[TouchStone]

Last weekend autocross runs.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIhftrFSj_g&feature=youtu.be

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Hey Joshua,
Look like you were having lots of fun. Getting faster also.
I noticed you didn't have to much body roll. What springs and sway bar are you running?
Bob

[TouchStone]

Hey Joshua,
Look like you were having lots of fun. Getting faster also.
I noticed you didn't have to much body roll. What springs and sway bar are you running?
Bob

I've got the stock 818s springs in the front #350 and #550 in the rear, with the donor sway sway bar.

Another racer helped me adjust tire pressures between run 2 and 3, just a couple pounds of pressure makes a ton of difference.

[Bob_n_Cincy]

I've got the stock 818s springs in the front (i think #275) and #550 in the rear, with the donor sway sway bar.

Another racer helped me adjust tire pressures between run 2 and 3, just a couple pounds of pressure makes a ton of difference.

Josh
can you double check the springs. The 818s stock are 350 front and 275 rears.
Bob

[TouchStone]

Its #350 in the front

[TouchStone]

I'm definitely going backwards at this point. My FFR fuel tank leaks around the fuel pick up so I'm trying to fix it with Seal All.

Other than that my goals for the next 2 weeks are:

Interior Aluminum
Upholstery and Carpet
5-point harness
New Seats
Sound System


So far I've pulled the old seats out and cut to fit the center console.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1641/26296897871_5f3f42936c_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/G4LtyT)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1653/26363136465_ae0201a45b_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/GaBXZB)

[billjr212]

Many (including myself) have had the fuel leak issue. Suggest you save yourself the headache and switch to the proper o rings while you have easy access. Solved my fuel leak issue.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?17937-Fuel-tank-leak&p=214070&viewfull=1#post214070

[TouchStone]

Many (including myself) have had the fuel leak issue. Suggest you save yourself the headache and switch to the proper o rings while you have easy access. Solved my fuel leak issue.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?17937-Fuel-tank-leak&p=214070&viewfull=1#post214070

I didn't realize there was an actual solution in that thread other than "replace the tank". I got a couple of those O-rings but I'm sort of committed with the Seal All for now. I'll see how well it hold up.

[TouchStone]

Installed engine cover hinge from replica parts and fitted a gas spring to hold it open. The single spring holds the cover no problem but I'm going to add a second to improve the feel and help keep it from shutting too hard. The bracket angles look weird because they are.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1462/26224586540_e006597d13_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/FXnRVN)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1709/25894610103_4db6280367_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/FsdDqT)

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1524/26497441235_c4404ba7e7_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Gnuj86)

Also, installing speakers.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1710/26372381251_1383ecdd7c_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Gbrm9t)

[Frank818]

Nice gas spring! Will keep that in mind if I decided to do the same.

[nkw8181]

Very nicely done. (Now to copy)

[TouchStone]

I lowered my tire pressures from 35 to 22 psi for this run. Which gave me a lot more control in the corners. In the fourth run I experienced a loss of power during the straights and now my fuel pump makes a ton of noise and is audible over the running engine. Dropped out of the afternoon heat to make sure I could still get home without a tow truck.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuywXMFCCfI

[Hindsight]

Looks and sounds very nice! How full was your tank?

[TouchStone]

Looks and sounds very nice! How full was your tank?

Today it was full. I actually noticed the power-loss the day before and the fuel level was my first thought. The sender was reading 3/8 full so assuming this actually means its empty I immediately filled it up and the problem went away until today. I'm guessing it broke yesterday (either spontaneously or due to starvation) and is quickly getting worse.

[Hindsight]

I wonder if it's the pump itself or an issue with the hose that attaches to the pump inside the tank.... keep us posted. Glad you quit once it started doing that.

[STiPWRD]

Which pump are you running? I've been thinking about picking up Holley's Hydramat to prevent any fuel starvation issues. The autocross runs looked great btw!

[TouchStone]

Walbro 342

The hydraMat looks promising, would be much cheaper than a surge tank.

For a surge tank install how is the pickup pump protected during fuel starvation? I don't see the point if the pickup can be easily damaged as well.

[Mechie3]

Are you worried about the pump overheating or cavitation?

[TouchStone]

Are you worried about the pump overheating or cavitation?

My best guess is that the pump overheats very quickly without constant fuel. Cavitation occurs when the pump is running too hard or the lines are too restrictive, right?

Mainly I don't want the pump/s or engine to be exposed to any conditions that can cause damage.

[STiPWRD]

Cavitation is when the pump is sucking up intermittent air bubbles and fuel. This causes a lot of stress on the pump blades as the mass of liquid fuel between air bubbles hits the pump blades and pulsates. I'm not sure if this is the leading cause of pump damage or the overheating.

[Hindsight]

With a full or nearly full tank, I'm wondering how the fuel pump pickup could even come into play.

[TouchStone]

With a full or nearly full tank, I'm wondering how the fuel pump pickup could even come into play.

I'm thinking the main damage occurred the day before when the sender was reading ~3/8 full in the older FFR tank. This was when I first noticed the problem. I then immediately filled the tank and didn't have the issue again until the next day.

[TouchStone]

I've decided to replace everything about the FFR fuel tank. New tank, pump and sender. So I pulled the old tank out and found a couple of interesting things. First, the tank was leaking from the sender location as suspected even with "seal all" liberally applied. I also did the following test: I drained the fuel tank before removing from the car by connecting the fuel pump to 12v and feeding the return line into a spare fuel tank. I ran this until the pump began picking up air. Then pulled the tank and measured the remaining fuel volume. I had about 1.7 gallons still in the tank! I assume you would need at least double this to cover the pump inlet adequately for driving and more if you want to race.


Tank removed. Had to disconnect the wiring harness from the engine to get the tank out easily. A bulkhead connector at the rear firewall would have been nice in hindsight.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7797/26278509173_75b8737c64_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/G39efn)

Fuel left in tank after the EFI pump started picking up air. About 1.7 gallons.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7468/26277305754_7b49ab0aa1_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/G334vL)

Looks like the fuel pump bag filter was folded and only a small portion of the filter was used. I should have also washed out the inside of the tank. Hopefully the fuel filter caught anything that could damage the injectors.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7517/26963990675_46f2b323fa_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/H5Hv1X)

As a bonus this guy need to add more blinker fluid, looks low to me.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7275/26963793295_1302b11c45_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/H5GukR)

[Frank818]

Looks crap your filter! I tested 35L, I am currently testing 35L in the tank, so far so good, but I had to put A LOT of fuel sealant around the fuel filler tube and use 4 clamps, one is a t-bolt. I am just over the sender hole level and with the sealant I put there a year ago it seems ok. What sealant are (were) you using?

[TouchStone]

I used "Seal All" http://www.amazon.com/Seal-All-380011-Seal-All%C2%AE-oz-Adhesive/dp/B0000AXYZG, it says its fuel resistant. I looks like it may have reacted with the powder coating a bit, caused the powder coat to de-laminate and leak underneath it. I'm replacing all the fuel filters.

[TouchStone]

Did some welding...Its actually the first welding I've done directly to the frame.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7590/26435812413_ab0291432d_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Gh3s2c)

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7650/26970916851_2558a82590.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/H6jZVM)

[Hindsight]

Looks good... it is a real pain welding in that spot.

[TouchStone]

Anyone have issues with the FFR powdercoat? I went to strip off a section of powder-coating to weld on an additional bracket to my frame and shortly after I began sanding the powder-coating flaked off to reveal rusty metal. I hope this was the only spot they missed when cleaning the metal.

[07FIREBLADE]

Its a common issue with ffr powdercoat. I have a few spots that flaked off when I first got the car and most recently right in front of the passenger seat cross bar. I got the $10k kit car comment and its only was a $400 option I believe...

[Mechie3]

Its a common issue with ffr powdercoat. I have a few spots that flaked off when I first got the car and most recently right in front of the passenger seat cross bar. I got the $10k kit car comment and its only was a $400 option I believe...

:rolleyes:

IMO, cost should dictate performance and features, not a lack of quality.

[RM1SepEx]

:rolleyes:

IMO, cost should dictate performance and features, not a lack of quality.

couldn't agree more, I'd never order it again based on my experience

[TouchStone]

Its a common issue with ffr powdercoat. I have a few spots that flaked off when I first got the car and most recently right in front of the passenger seat cross bar. I got the $10k kit car comment and its only was a $400 option I believe...

That's the same location I found the rust.

The $10K kit comment is not valid since FFR offer this same powdercoat option on all of their kits. According to FFR video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwLkvBB4RBE the powder coat will last decades and they can offer it so cheaply because they only offer a single color. I don't think FFR applys the powdercoat in house but that doesn't mean they can't increase quality control requirements on their CM. Especially if this is happening more often than not. What bother me most is that the powdercoat will cover up and mask any poor quality work, "What you don't know won't hurt you" right?

[Bob_n_Cincy]

What bother me most is that the powdercoat will cover up and mask any poor quality work, "What you don't know won't hurt you" right?

I disagree with your statement here.
I suspect about 25% (WAG) of frames ship without powder.
The welding guys don't know if it is getting powder or not.
I got both of mine bare because I wanted a different color.
A few very experienced welders looked a my frame and had no problems with the welding.
A single layer powder coat cost me $800 locally.

Form the comment I've heard on here over the years. The comments on bad powder have decreased significantly since the beginning of the 818. I suspect FFR has either implemented a better quality plan for their vendor or their own in house.
Bob

[Frank818]

I have #181 and my powder coat is really good. There's virtually nothing I have against it. In fact, I have more against the fact that all the welding splatters have not been ground off rather than bad powder coat itself. Nowhere on mine I have seen flakes, except if I accidentally remove powder coat to the bare metal, then yes there are some areas (mostly the brackets in the back) that tend to flake off. POR15 takes care of it.

[TouchStone]

I disagree with your statement here.
I suspect about 25% (WAG) of frames ship without powder.
The welding guys don't know if it is getting powder or not.
I got both of mine bare because I wanted a different color.
A few very experienced welders looked a my frame and had no problems with the welding.
A single layer powder coat cost me $800 locally.

Form the comment I've heard on here over the years. The comments on bad powder have decreased significantly since the beginning of the 818. I suspect FFR has either implemented a better quality plan for their vendor or their own in house.
Bob

I'm not saying the welding is bad in fact it looks really good. What I mean to say is that the powdercoat will cover up poorly cleaned metal.

I'm just disappointed at all the little things that have added up related to the powdercoat. On delivery there was a large scuffed area on the roll bar. Welding splatter is sharp and detracts from the look. Now finding rust under the powdercoat.

It basically adds up to the fact that I should have had the powdercoat applied locally.

[TouchStone]

I received my fuel tank from Boyd welding, design courtesy of Craig at Zero Decibel Motorsports. The assembly looks great and is very sturdy.

https://c5.staticflickr.com/8/7723/26840043164_01dc1c0a04_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/GTLeJU)

https://c8.staticflickr.com/8/7324/27377836871_daf47450be_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/HHhz5c)

[07FIREBLADE]

Looks good. I might have to hit Craig up for the design too. How much was this setup again.

[ssssly]

I'm not saying the welding is bad in fact it looks really good. What I mean to say is that the powdercoat will cover up poorly cleaned metal.

I'm just disappointed at all the little things that have added up related to the powdercoat. On delivery there was a large scuffed area on the roll bar. Welding splatter is sharp and detracts from the look. Now finding rust under the powdercoat.

It basically adds up to the fact that I should have had the powdercoat applied locally.

There was powder coat flaking off my frame when it was delivered.

As of when I went out to FFR, the frames received zero prep before powder and they were not outgassed prior to curing.

The worst spots will be where several tubes come together. The blued areas around the weld outgas during the cure. The resulting bubbles hold gas against the steel and rust builds up under the powder coat flaking it off.

I went without the powder for my second frame and had it done locally. Blasted, outgassed and then coated. Zero problems.

[Mechie3]

Looks good. I might have to hit Craig up for the design too. How much was this setup again.

Josh's has a few additional/different features than mine but I think both of ours started at $375. Where it gets expensive for the non machine shop able people is the tank mounting plates from Boyd are $349 and you need two (with a $110 pump included). You need two of those. I went with Walbro 255 ($75/ea) and made my own plates (probably $75 in materials). If you don't care how pretty the plates are it would be easy to make your own with a band saw and drill press as they're mostly just flat plates.

[TouchStone]

Finally finished my seat mount brackets, paint is drying as I write this. Once the aluminum floor panel is back in place it would have been impossible to bolt in the seats so I welded in some mounting tabs with nuts welded to the underside of each tab. I have to move the firewall back an inch in order to fit the seats I ordered fortunately the new fuel tank has just enough clearance to let everything fit.

https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7141/28219843251_fb022b9dc5_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/JZG5ez)

[TouchStone]

Made a bit of progress these last two weekends. Adjusted the fuel fill neck. I was able to use FFR fill tube by cutting out a section and shortening one end. Wired up the fuel tank and transfer pump. I switched out the transfer pump from a K&N pump to Airtex E8016S, the noise that the K&N pump made was very loud and obnoxious. Added indicator for low fuel in surge tank. Added wiring for heated seats. Added sound mat and carpet under the seat area. Added vinyl upholstery to the center console.

https://c2.staticflickr.com/9/8705/27845633353_d55d3526de_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/JqC9EM)

https://c7.staticflickr.com/9/8349/28357024102_b9010b9dee_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KcPajE)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8886/28649618816_9095afa877_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KDEMx7)

https://c7.staticflickr.com/8/7539/28397498390_ab2908232f_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KgoAVd)

[Hindsight]

Looking very clean as always. Where did you source the vinyl and are you happy with it? I think it looks really good.

[TouchStone]

Looking very clean as always. Where did you source the vinyl and are you happy with it? I think it looks really good.

I got the vinyl from HobbyLobby, they only had one option for textured vinyl so I went with it. It has a fabric backing which adds strength and prevents it from stretching, also has a small amount of cushion which makes it feel more expensive. I'm using the same vinyl to make a custom boot for the e-brake handle. I'll see how it holds up to the Texas heat.

[Hindsight]

Very cool! Plenty of Hobby Lobbys around here so I may give it a shot for some trim pieces.

[Frank818]

Shortening one end on the filler neck? Yeah that would help but it also needs to be turned on the left side (fwd) in order to face about 3" fwd than what it does originally. How did you fix that? Simply twisting counter clockwise a quarter of a turn or so the upper part after shortening?

[TouchStone]

Shortening one end on the filler neck? Yeah that would help but it also needs to be turned on the left side (fwd) in order to face about 3" fwd than what it does originally. How did you fix that? Simply twisting counter clockwise a quarter of a turn or so the upper part after shortening?

I removed the lower 45 deg. bend which left me with an L piece and a S piece. I cut 1-2 inches off of the longer part of the L so both ends were about the same in length. Then I rotated the 90 deg. part until it fit close enough. The alignment was off by about 3-5 deg. which is close enough for the rubber coupling pieces to compensate for.

[TouchStone]

Center console is in and finished! It's inevitable but I still hope I wont have to take it apart since I spun a rivnut:mad:. The center console has switches to control the heated seats and a hidden security switch.

https://c6.staticflickr.com/8/7772/28660427941_cb14064f2d_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KECbHk)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8644/28705553136_84a218f1ac_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KJBsRW)

[Hindsight]

Very nice and clean. Looks like a good seal on the e-brake cover to firewall too.

[UnhipPopano]

What caused the Rivnut to spin? Was it not fully seated?

[TouchStone]

What caused the Rivnut to spin? Was it not fully seated?

The rivnut was not centered well and I used a power tool while cross threading the bolt.

[TouchStone]

Done with the interior.

https://c3.staticflickr.com/9/8743/28820341282_fa70cafe6f_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KUKMnU)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8733/28820341352_c371a41e75_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KUKMp7)

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Done with the interior.

https://c3.staticflickr.com/9/8743/28820341282_fa70cafe6f_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KUKMnU)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8733/28820341352_c371a41e75_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KUKMp7)

Very Nice,
I really like your shifter, Very cool. What is the functions of the springs?
Bob

[matteo92065]

clean looking!

[TouchStone]

Very Nice,
I really like your shifter, Very cool. What is the functions of the springs?
Bob

They are centering springs.

[AZPete]

Cool outside door handles. What are they?

Edit: I found them in your earlier post. They are Fiat Barchetta handles from Ebay . . . thanks.

For other guys who also like these handles:
Left and Right were sold separately:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/371064017334...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
http://www.ebay.com/itm/271493405643...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

[Frank818]

Love the result. Love the seats. Love the handles.

Pete, your links are destroyed.

[TouchStone]

Thanks guys, I have a few things left to do before I call it complete. Its a bit early but I've started looking for my next build.

[Frank818]

What is your next build?

[Lumpyguy]

how do you like the BOSS bluetooth control? does it just run to an amp? I have been looking at a Kenwood Blutooth amp with remote.

[TouchStone]

how do you like the BOSS bluetooth control? does it just run to an amp? I have been looking at a Kenwood Blutooth amp with remote.

The BOSS does everything I want feature wise. Just not powerful enough for an open top loud engine car.

[TouchStone]

What is your next build?

Haven't decided. GTM or maybe Ecoboost 818C, if FFR releases it.

[TouchStone]

Ran an autocross today. Car performed really well no fuel starvation at 1/4 to half tank. However with good news comes bad, around my fourth run I started getting a large amount of smoke out of the tailpipe every time I applied throttle from idle. I haven't determined the cause yet.

Fastest Run:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6-logYr7Ag

All Runs:
https://youtu.be/cm_S2wZfQHU

[Frank818]

Hum that video is blocked at work here but what color was that smoke?

[TouchStone]

Hum that video is blocked at work here but what color was that smoke?

It was white.

[Frank818]

Coolant leak somewhere?

[TouchStone]

Problem is caused by oil in the intake. Pulled off the AWIC and found their was enough oil build up in the AWIC housing to leak into the intake manifold. I highly suspect the Perrin AOS installation to be at fault. I found that the included plastic NPT fittings were all very loose and needed 2-3 more rotations to re-tighten. I'm also raising the height of the AOS about an inch to improve oil drain. This does however interfere with the engine cover gas bar I previously installed. Cleaned out the pooled up oil and drove around the block and it was much better, (no smoke) I'll have to keep an eye on it for awhile as the oil build up is pretty slow.

[TouchStone]

Finally making some decent progress on the body. All the uncured gelcoat and resin has been removed and filled with fiberglass reinforcement or body filler. Corners and edges have been restored. Panel insides have been coated with rubberized under-body paint. I also added a support to the engine cover to reinforce a thin area that had started to crack.

https://c3.staticflickr.com/6/5522/30358232434_d2be8b743b_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/NfDSQA)

https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5556/31011356241_6c5099eff7_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PfniMT)

https://c5.staticflickr.com/6/5487/30758016820_796b01d62d_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/NRYSNQ)

[Hindsight]

Looks great. What kind of underbody spray did you use and does it seem like it will stand up to heat of the engine?

I had to reinforce my engine cover due to cracking in the same area.

[Frank818]

Nice paint. That's the 3M rubberized underbody paint? No asphalt?

[TouchStone]

Nice paint. That's the 3M rubberized underbody paint? No asphalt?

Asphalt??

Rust-Oleum Rubberized Undercoating. According to their tech sheet the main ingredient is SBR rubber which is good up to 212F. There is a PRO version of this paint that cost twice as much I could not tell a difference from the label other than the pro version can have the second coat applied after only 2 mins.

Actually...I just checked the can the cheaper stuff can also be reapplied after just a couple mins. So I have no idea what the difference is.

Rust-Oleum Rubberized Undercoating SKU 248657 (http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/pdfImages/cd/cd585606-a60e-41e5-b88e-ad5bd353ab43.pdf)
Rust-Oleum® Professional Undercoating SKU 248656 (https://www.rustoleum.com/~/media/DigitalEncyclopedia/Documents/RustoleumUSA/TDS/English/CBG/Automotive/ATO-38_Automotive_Professional_Undercoating_TDS.ashx)

[Frank818]

Yeah asphalt, some products are asphalt based but I assumed it was pretty nasty stuff and wanted to stay away.

I currently have some truck bed liner stuff but I'm unsure it's as good as rubberized underbody and rocker panel stuff. Will try to find the rusto or sometihng similar.

tnx!

[Scargo]

Perhaps TMI? "Professional", Alkyd (https://www.rustoleum.com/~/media/DigitalEncyclopedia/Documents/RustoleumUSA/TDS/English/CBG/Automotive/ATO-38_Automotive_Professional_Undercoating_TDS.ashx): DRY & RECOAT TIMES... Dry and recoat times are based on 70°F and 50% relative humidity. Dries to touch in 10 minutes. Allow more time in cooler temperatures. The surface can be recoated within 1 hour or after 24 hours. Allow 72 hours for full cure. Has temp rating of 200°F/93°C.
The "non-professional" SBR (http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/pdfImages/cd/cd585606-a60e-41e5-b88e-ad5bd353ab43.pdf) (styrene-butadiene rubber) coating does not list a service temperature but I've seen some listed as low as 180°F. Polystyrene can be thermoformed as low as 260°F. Realistically, there might not be much difference in the two, performance-wise. SBR might be less chemical/fuel resistant.
I found this discussion on undercoats. (http://www.ffcars.com/forums/17-factory-five-roadsters/262329-asphalt-based-undercoatings.html) There is asphalt undercoater. I think it's very old technology, can be hard and brittle and melts with low VOC solvents (including gasoline or kerosene).
With either product be sure and have really good ventilation and/or painter's mask.

[Frank818]

Tnx for the info Scargo. I really hope you find a way to get your health back.

[TouchStone]

Wrap in progress. This is not easy:(.

https://c3.staticflickr.com/6/5613/31253932546_779ffcd30c_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PBNzgY)

https://c6.staticflickr.com/6/5647/30480389813_dd82ced4b3_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/NrrXYi)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5323/30466286864_c585693bd7_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/NqcFE1)

6 hours earlier:
https://c7.staticflickr.com/6/5620/30466285894_9727ce8c67_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/NqcFnh)

[Scargo]

But it's looking great and you will pick up speed. Have you watched how easy it is on YouTube??:cool: I am still on the fence. I have painting equipment and know how to do that.

[Frank818]

Did you watch this? Might help understand a few things and after a couple panels yes you should speed up.



http://youtu.be/aU8f8pi06Hs
Courtesy of Jeff


6h for relatively easy panels is long yes. I have estimated 100h to wrap the car. If I do it faster, then good.

[Scargo]

The expressions on some faces in the audience are priceless.

[STiPWRD]

Which company and color did you go with for the wrap? I'm also considering doing a wrap myself so looking forward to some feedback/tips.

[TouchStone]

I've watched it at least three times ;) It is very helpful and is the reason I managed to wrap those panels the first time without having to start over.

[TouchStone]

Which company and color did you go with for the wrap? I'm also considering doing a wrap myself so looking forward to some feedback/tips.

I am using 3M 1080 Series.

I'm too new too give out tips but I'll let you know when I'm done. For what its worth on the application I like it better than Vivid as it is easier to re-position if you haven't applied pressure.

[Frank818]

So 6h with the tips of the video, gives an idea. But tell ya what, there are 11 body panels, say 1 day per panel, that's only 11 days, not to bad!! I went crazy and estimated 1 month of work at 25h/week, I guess I can make within that time, right.

Vvivid's 8th gen wrap is supposed to be easier on applying, but maybe not as much as 3M, true. Where Vvivid takes some back is at the price. Overall for what the 8th gen offers the price is really really good, but as a first wrap, I don't know. 3M and one other (Avery maybe) are awesome for that. I went with Vvivid, the only one I cold found the color I wanted. So I estimated 100h lolll

So far yours look really great, can't wait to see your other panels! Plz post pix once you complete another one and another one and so on. )

[TouchStone]

Learning from my mistakes on the passenger side panel (which I'll need to redo). I outlined and cut a rough shape of the driver side panel. Started the application from the back of the panel and worked my way forward. The contours of the panel bent the forward running board area part of the vinyl down and caused a misalignment issue. I managed to salvage it by using lots of heat to stretch a fit. I should have taken pictures mid-application as it looked horrific all bunched together and rolled around itself, its hard to believe it came out better than the passenger side. Side vents are the only thing that came out wrong. No way could I get the material to stretch and fit. About 10 hours to get the side panels mostly done.

Step 1: Outline
https://c3.staticflickr.com/6/5835/30490490314_c438f703b0_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/NskJuS)

Step 2: Cut
https://c7.staticflickr.com/6/5786/31276183406_eb311e2c59_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PDLBFu)

Step 3: Apply
https://c5.staticflickr.com/6/5821/31276183796_c56bcb85b2_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PDLBNd)

And your done!
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5625/31197540841_0f280efc48_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PwPxZc)

Special Note: Don't burn yourself
https://c7.staticflickr.com/6/5551/31276182246_2b7ac5b912_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PDLBku)

[Frank818]

It turned out pretty good. I mean on the side sail, not your skin.

I see you are leaving the door step red? Any reason for that?

[TouchStone]

It turned out pretty good. I mean on the side sail, not your skin.

I see you are leaving the door step red? Any reason for that?

I was working on it till 2am, I had to stop. On the passenger side I tried using a single piece to get the whole panel but it became very difficult and I had to use multiple cuts to prevent over/under stretching. On the driver side I've pre-planned for a cut on the door step to make the seam straight and even. I'll get a close up picture of the seam once I'm done.

[Frank818]

Ok I get it, the reason is time on the clock. :)

What you're saying here is really interesting cuz I always thought that if there is a cut you will see it, which is why I thought that if I start wrapping a panel, I have to finish it before I do something else (eat, go to work, go to sleep, etc.). So how does it really work, if you know yet, when you apply a piece that cuts at a certain place and then apply another piece starting from the cut point? Like on your door steps, will the cut between the 2 pieces be very visible?

Also when you overlap pieces, do you know if it is very visible on the overlapped area?

I think so far you're the 1st one showing detailed pix and steps of your wrapping progress.

[Frank818]

I think I found the answer on the seam. If the job is done right, the seam disappears. There are about 3 ways of doing it, you either place the second piece as close as possible to the seam to match it, or you overlap and cut a seam through the overlap, or you use threaded tape pulling the thread from under the wrap, cutting the seam through. Still need to overlap pieces to do that.

[TouchStone]

I wouldn't leave any one piece of vinyl wrap unfinished. The adhesive on un-applied edges will pick up dust and dirt.

I did a seam test before I started on butting up the edges: It looks good when your using different colors but when using the same color the seam is more visible. Ill post pictures of this tonight. I'm using knife-less tape and trying to avoid using an exacto knife on the body.

[RetroRacing]

Get a friend to help, it's way easier to do with two or more people. THe only stuff to use is 3m 1080, trust me, we tried others. Yes, you can make the seams disappear, takes practice, but not difficult. We were doing a pieces every 1-2 hours once we got the hang of it and knew where to pull and how far to stretch, metallic does not like to stretch to much, or the color will change. Flat colors are stupid easy, especially black.
61495

[07FIREBLADE]

What color blue is that. I'm really tempted to wrap now instead of painting.

[TouchStone]

Get a friend to help, it's way easier to do with two or more people. THe only stuff to use is 3m 1080, trust me, we tried others. Yes, you can make the seams disappear, takes practice, but not difficult. We were doing a pieces every 1-2 hours once we got the hang of it and knew where to pull and how far to stretch, metallic does not like to stretch to much, or the color will change. Flat colors are stupid easy, especially black.
61495

What are the openings on the side for? Air intake? What and where did you get those mirrors?

I'm going to copy your color scheme on the front bumper now that I've seen it. ;)

I agree on the friend part, much easier, but it can be done by yourself.

[Frank818]

Did you watch this for edges and corners?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwnLmE6Je0s

[Frank818]

And how about this, for 3-sided corners that we have a couple of? Like the side sails above the striker. I finally understand how they do it and I was pretty sure you had to cut a seam to make it through.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLttn_Gh2TQ


I start to wonder if I should buy that tape...

[RetroRacing]

3M matte metallic, we love it!. The front CF verticals are just to keep the vortex created by the canards, up against the side of the car. helps pull air from the front brakes and cuts down on drag. The rear duct has been extended to try to get more air movement in the engine bay.

[Frank818]

THe only stuff to use is 3m 1080, trust me, we tried others.

Could you plz list us which ones you've tried?

[RetroRacing]

3 different ones out of China, I will see if I can find the names. Have not tried Avery yet, but have heard good things from my Vinyl guy

[Frank818]

I understand your fascination about 3M then! It's true they are super easy to apply, probably the easiest, but all the non-China wraps have a much better quality than China-made. Avery, Arlon, Hexis, Vvivid are so much better than China, according to all reviews you can find.

[TouchStone]

Finished the driver side panel. Decided to play with some black on the side vents. Vinyl wrap is great, if I decide I don't like how something came out I can tear it off and start over.

https://c6.staticflickr.com/6/5349/30541708653_0b5410326e_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/NwSeVF)

https://c7.staticflickr.com/6/5569/30980343510_2f5def0810_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PcCmMC)

https://c7.staticflickr.com/6/5646/30980343550_b92d56c554_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PcCmNj)

Here is a close up of an overlapping seam.
https://c7.staticflickr.com/6/5779/31205205942_86e6c45eaf_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PxuQy7)

Started on the front bumper, but I tore a hole in the middle of wrapping the first section. I'm not even sure how or when it happened. I finished wrapping this section for practice and plan to replace it later.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5777/31313029936_0dc05fdb14_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PH2sSu)

[Frank818]

Hey Touch, nice result man! The seams don't show up that much and I'm pretty sure no one would notice except those who spend a lot of time looking closely for so-called imperfections. Besides when the door is closed (most of the time), they will not show.

You could probably make a cut at the exact line where the wrap from underneath stops. It would push the seam a little more inwards and there would be no overlap. But if you miss your cut then the red gel coat will appear.

Good look on the side scoops! Hope you'll leave it like that.

[Scargo]

Looking really good!
Are you using any of the knifeless cutting tape? I have used a technique, mostly in wallpapering, where you overlap edges and cut through the middle, then peel out the piece underneath, much like they do with the cutting tape. Then the edges butt quite well. Might be a problem with vinyl if the area is stretched much.
Am curious what it will cost you to do this as I have spray equipment but am leaning towards vinyl.

[TouchStone]

Looking really good!
Are you using any of the knifeless cutting tape? I have used a technique, mostly in wallpapering, where you overlap edges and cut through the middle, then peel out the piece underneath, much like they do with the cutting tape. Then the edges butt quite well. Might be a problem with vinyl if the area is stretched much.
Am curious what it will cost you to do this as I have spray equipment but am leaning towards vinyl.

You can use that technique with knifeless tape. Lay down 2 strips of tape an 1/8" apart. Apply first material and trim with tape. Apply 2nd material and trim both sheets with the 2nd strip of knifeless tape. Finally remove the 1/8" strip of the first material that is stuck under the 2nd material. May be easier to understand if you just watch this https://youtu.be/FknbgFrUALI?t=2m7s

In my opinion this works well if your using 2 different colors at the seam and not so much if your using the same material. Also the red gelcoat really stands out if the seam is not perfect.

https://c5.staticflickr.com/6/5758/31185902332_a91922315a_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PvMUgf)

https://c6.staticflickr.com/6/5693/31214933261_71bf42a230_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PymG9v)

https://c8.staticflickr.com/6/5450/30522498343_35843dc5af_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/NvaMnr)

[Scargo]

A good, ol' fashioned #11 X-Acto knife blade might work wonders. You will be cutting into the gell coat a little, I assume. I suppose a third layer to cut against could be added. Again, stretching the vinyl is likely to have the edge draw back some once cut. Is the vinyl noch sensitive, like styrene?
I am just guessing as I haven't worked with vinyl yet, but I've worked with fine-line tape and masks.

[Wayne Presley]

Have you tried the vinyl film cutting wire on seams?

[turbomacncheese]

You can use that technique with knifeless tape. Lay down 2 strips of tape an 1/8" apart. Apply first material and trim with tape. Apply 2nd material and trim both sheets with the 2nd strip of knifeless tape. Finally remove the 1/8" strip of the first material that is stuck under the 2nd material. May be easier to understand if you just watch this https://youtu.be/FknbgFrUALI?t=2m7s


Great video!!!

[TouchStone]

Have you tried the vinyl film cutting wire on seams?

Sure have, its called Knifeless finish line/tape. It works great, the more you plan ahead with it the better.

https://www.amazon.com/Knifeless-Finish-Line-Cutting-Stripes/dp/B007XY5K6K/ref=sr_1_1?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1480623727&sr=1-1&keywords=knifeless+tape

[TouchStone]

Half of the front bumper is finished.

https://c6.staticflickr.com/6/5705/31368715725_4211100016_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PMWSji)

https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5333/31368715825_0f0784670c_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PMWSm2)

[Wayne Presley]

That looks great

[ben1272]

If you dont mind me asking, what is a good price for 60" vinyl? Do you have a vendor that you like to buy from?

You are doing a real nice job!

[Frank818]

If you dont mind me asking, what is a good price for 60" vinyl?

My search says USD30-35 for a 5x5 piece of a 5x50 roll. If 5x5 alone it could be more than each 5x5 on a 5x50 roll.
3M would be more in the 45 bucks range. Also take into account that price varies on the type of wrap. Matte, gloss, chrome finish, carbon fiber, etc. Impossible to tell what is a good price unless we know exactly what you're looking for.

[ben1272]

Thanks for ballpark. Dont know what I am looking for yet, but this thread has made me consider wrapping the car myself. Or at least giving a panel a try to see how I do. Thanks for sharing the info and the links. Good stuff!

How nice does the body work need to be from your experience?

[TouchStone]

Thanks for ballpark. Dont know what I am looking for yet, but this thread has made me consider wrapping the car myself. Or at least giving a panel a try to see how I do. Thanks for sharing the info and the links. Good stuff!

How nice does the body work need to be from your experience?

It was ~$475 for 5x50ft and ~$100 for 5x10ft.

I thinks its color dependent but the vinyl covers pinhole defects well but nothing else. I went through the process of cleaning (remove wax and uncured gel-coat), body filler, then sand to a 220 grit.

[Frank818]

I went through the process of cleaning (remove wax and uncured gel-coat), body filler, then sand to a 220 grit.

You removed wax using which product? I go a few but want to see if you needed something powerful or not.

The body filler you used it to make the panels smoother in terms of lines? Filling small holes, crevases, etc.?

[TouchStone]

You removed wax using which product? I go a few but want to see if you needed something powerful or not.

The body filler you used it to make the panels smoother in terms of lines? Filling small holes, crevases, etc.?

Purple power and a green Scotch bright pad to remove the wax. Acetone to remove uncured gelcoat. Rage Gold for body filler. 50% isopropyl alcohol for final cleaning and dust removal before applying the vinyl wrap.

[Frank818]

Oh my, that's a lot more prep than I thought. I was hoping to go simple and use acetone or brake cleaner for everything (except body filling of course). Acetone removes wax, at least car wax but I don't know if it's the same type on the body panels.

Maybe 70% isopropyl alcohol could remove wax and final dust cleaning before applying. I'll do some search as to what people do for the prep! I'm glad I asked.

[TouchStone]

Oh my, that's a lot more prep than I thought. I was hoping to go simple and use acetone or brake cleaner for everything (except body filling of course). Acetone removes wax, at least car wax but I don't know if it's the same type on the body panels.

Maybe 70% isopropyl alcohol could remove wax and final dust cleaning before applying. I'll do some search as to what people do for the prep! I'm glad I asked.

I followed others' threads on how to prep the body for paint so I may have done more than necessary. From what I gathered their is a layer of mold release wax on the panels that needs to be removed by some chemical & scrubbing. Sanding wont work as it will push the wax further into the panel.

[Frank818]

Man that's great info! :)

So far I believe just acetone will do the trick, after the search I did. Of course doing more will not kill anyone and you'll more than certain of the positive effects.

I thought sanding would remove that damn wax! I hope it's removeable after sanding, with chemicals... I have quite some spots already sanded due to gel coat fixes.


Did you need to use 3M Primer 94 on tight edges and curves?

[TouchStone]

Man that's great info! :)

So far I believe just acetone will do the trick, after the search I did. Of course doing more will not kill anyone and you'll more than certain of the positive effects.

I thought sanding would remove that damn wax! I hope it's removeable after sanding, with chemicals... I have quite some spots already sanded due to gel coat fixes.


Did you need to use 3M Primer 94 on tight edges and curves?

I did not use primer, I don't think it's necessary on the external surface. I thought it would be best used on the body filler. So I did a peel test and when removing vinyl that had been applied over body filler and set for over a day the wrap was very hard to remove and you could even see that it has lifted a very thin layer of the filler material. What I am most concerned about is the adhesion to the back surface of the panel. I did a lot less work on the back side, lightly sanded to 80 grit and spray painted with undercoating. I don't think my wrap is going to stick very long to this surface so I'm planning on adding plastic edge strips and/or the primer to the back side. If someone has a better idea I'd like to know about it.

[Frank818]

I did not use primer, I don't think it's necessary on the external surface. I thought it would be best used on the body filler. So I did a peel test and when removing vinyl that had been applied over body filler and set for over a day the wrap was very hard to remove and you could even see that it has lifted a very thin layer of the filler material. What I am most concerned about is the adhesion to the back surface of the panel. I did a lot less work on the back side, lightly sanded to 80 grit and spray painted with undercoating. I don't think my wrap is going to stick very long to this surface so I'm planning on adding plastic edge strips and/or the primer to the back side. If someone has a better idea I'd like to know about it.

Well 3M 94 Primer is mostly used on sharp edges, not sure people use it for a full surface and body panels primer. It helps the wrap keeping its sharp turnaround like on hood edges. Then it would probably do a good job to hold the wrap in the inside surface of the panels. I didn't think about that but now you mention it, I think I'll get a pint of that primer and use it on the inside at least. I believe it would help on some edges of the nose insert, louvers' cut-outs and maybe the bottom outwards of the front fenders (new nose style). Just for the inside panels I think it's worth trying.

Tna again! :)

[flynntuna]

Cleaning wax and other contaminants off the body is nessasary before doing any sanding, otherwise those contaminants will be ground into the surface making it harder to get out.

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/archive/index.php/t-7602.html

[redfogo]

That vinyl is looking great! I wish I could get the hang of it. Everything I have tried in the past ended in vinyl disaster lol. Keep of the good work its looking amazing :D

[RetroRacing]

Great job!!

[TouchStone]

Wrapped the hood tonight. Unfortunately I made a mistake right at the end. Lesson learned is to not rush at the end and to not stretch the material too much. I may be able to leave it as is since I have other plans for that area. I have it temporarily patched in the final picture.

https://c5.staticflickr.com/6/5465/31417261636_01f2041459_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PSeFjL)https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5638/31308650712_595dbeb319_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PGD25C)https://c5.staticflickr.com/6/5527/31308650732_26316de6b9_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PGD25Y)https://c3.staticflickr.com/6/5716/31417262226_154a276db4_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PSeFuW)https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5730/31338494441_22df5e598b_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PKgYzF)https://c4.staticflickr.com/6/5653/31338493731_448bd10876_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PKgYnr)https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5735/31338494401_639ca0f0b4_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PKgYyZ)

[Frank818]

Really looking nice! And it's your 1st wrap! :)

Was the hood easier than any other panels so far (apart from doors)?

[flynntuna]

Looks great, it'll look good in the sun.

[TouchStone]

Was the hood easier than any other panels so far (apart from doors)?

The hood was about as difficult as the front fenders except for the air outlet area. I'm worried about the radiator heat causing the inside corners of the hood to peel off since I stretched the film quite a bit. I think I'm going to cut out the vinyl in those corners so I can apply new material without stretch.

[Frank818]

Surprising the hood was that difficult.

Maybe you can protect the vinyl with goild foil applied on top? Might prevent heat from doing anything on the inside corners.

[Mechie3]

Nice! Liking the blue.

[dallas_]

Dang, that's really cool. Looking good!

[TouchStone]

Made some more progress

https://c2.staticflickr.com/1/534/30754993713_930ef0e1eb_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/NRHo9i)

https://c2.staticflickr.com/1/726/31564411025_e2fec81f1c_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Q6eRHc)

[nkw8181]

sweet!!! looking good

[Frank818]

Really like the black you put around the humps. Very nice little touch to make a good difference!

[TouchStone]

I made a short tutorial on applying vinyl wrap inlays on the 818.
818 Vinyl Wrap Inlay (https://flic.kr/s/aHskNeapDA)

[Wayne Presley]

Very nice work Josh, I bet Nolan is jealous. :p

[Frank818]

I totally forgot about these very recessed areas! I guess I need that wired tape.

[nkw8181]

Just a bit Wayne

[TouchStone]

I totally forgot about these very recessed areas! I guess I need that wired tape.

I just ordered my 3rd roll of it.

[Frank818]

You bought rolls of how long?

[TouchStone]

You bought rolls of how long?

50 meter rolls. FYI I did the carbon fiber stripes with part of the first roll awhile ago.

[TouchStone]

I've been done with the vinyl wrap for several weeks now but I haven't reassembled the panels yet as I made a last minute decision to swap out the transmission. I'm having a new gear stack built by "ZF design" with gear ratios 3.166, 1.882, 1.296, .972 and ,738 w/ FD 3.7 and Torsen LSD. I got pictures from them during the build.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/456/32489995945_f48ba7dcab_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Rv2HRT)
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/775/32376958992_2dc3cf78bb_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Rk3nUU)

[Hindsight]

Very nice! Are those gears stronger than stock?

[TouchStone]

Very nice! Are those gears stronger than stock?

Yes, but only a little.

[UnhipPopano]

As the transmission normally sits at a different angle than when in a Subaru and these are different gears, are they providing an oil level recommendation?

[TouchStone]

As the transmission normally sits at a different angle than when in a Subaru and these are different gears, are they providing an oil level recommendation?

It's the same 5mt case so I plan to use the same amount as before.

[Frank818]

I was wondering where you were at with the wrapping... Still need a big overview picture, though. :)

You changed gears for what reason? I believe it's not strength, it is for better tuned ratios?

[TouchStone]

I was wondering where you were at with the wrapping... Still need a big overview picture, though. :)

You changed gears for what reason? I believe it's not strength, it is for better tuned ratios?

I haven't even seen it all together myself. The previous transmission had several bad syncros.

[TouchStone]

Now time to drive!

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2059/32032754013_425dc5cf54_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/QNCeLi)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2861/32032420953_d377489484_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/QNAwKT)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/519/32694121382_bf6c957b62_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/RP4VeY)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2187/32444876520_6bd03fec9d_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Rr3tqL)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2563/32784896266_ce0a247675_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/RX6asb)

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Very NICE Josh.
Bob

[dallas_]

Wow, that looks FANTASTIC!

[flynntuna]

That color combo looks great! The racing stripes are a nice touch. :cool:

[Mechie3]

The stripes on the front are fantastic!

[Mitch Wright]

The car looks great and love the color combo. Enjoy the ride, I am sure you and the car will get a ton of attention.

[AZPete]

Beautiful. I really like how your stripe incorporates both the hood vents and the engine cover humps.

[turbomacncheese]

Super nice, man. Attention to detail, amazing.

[mikeb75]

very nice finish!

[Hindsight]

Looks very nice! Clean!

[Frank818]

I knew you'd make it with the wrap! The result is just perfect! Enjoy the ride, you are really privileged to have a running legal 818!

[Maximus]

Looks beautiful! I'm trying to get a ballpark for total material used. I really like a few of VViViD's colors, but am not sure which roll size to start with. Thanks!

[TouchStone]

Looks beautiful! I'm trying to get a ballpark for total material used. I really like a few of VViViD's colors, but am not sure which roll size to start with. Thanks!

60-70ft by 5ft wide. I originally ordered 50ft x 5ft and was just a little too short.

[Frank818]

That much? They usually sell 50-55 for a car with top. Did you make a few mistakes and needed to trash some pieces?

[Maximus]

I've seen elsewhere that it is recommended to add 10-15% if you are new to wrapping over a professional job.

[TouchStone]

I've seen elsewhere that it is recommended to add 10-15% if you are new to wrapping over a professional job.

It was because of those recommendations that I got 50ft to begin with. The issue I found was that the side panels are very long and if want a single piece run front to back you'll end up with alot of useless material. I made one mistake with a front fender where I had to scrap some material, but to counter that I did not apply any of the base color material to the rear humps. Also I used 5 pieces on the rear bumper to be more conservative.

In total I needed:
60ft x 5ft blue (1 mid size mistake) no rear humps
15ft x 5ft black
10ft x 5ft orange
2 x rolls of knifeless tape

If your experienced at wrapping and conservative with the material then 50ft may be enough. This was my first attempt at wrapping and honestly my side pieces would not be considered "professional quality" had I not done it myself I would be taking it back to the shop for them to redo it. Which means I need more material on top of the list above.

[Frank818]

Thank you for making me buy another 20ft. Good thing is TODAY ONLY Vvivid is selling at 20% discount with "LOVEDAY" coupon.

[axelthrasher]

Car looks great! I do have a couple questions on your build - 1) I ran through the pages real quick, I didn't see any details on the headlights - custom? 2) The outside door handles - what are they off of? What all was required to add them?

[TouchStone]

Car looks great! I do have a couple questions on your build - 1) I ran through the pages real quick, I didn't see any details on the headlights - custom? 2) The outside door handles - what are they off of? What all was required to add them?

1) See the "Old Headlight Thread" http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?16429-Headlight-Thread-Camry-lights-(old)/page3

2) Handles are from a Fiat. The install was very easy, almost as if they were made for this car.
Handles: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?16780-JJ-s-818s-Build&p=208880&viewfull=1#post208880
Install: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?16780-JJ-s-818s-Build&p=208825&viewfull=1#post208825

[TouchStone]

Had an alignment and corner balance performed. Here's the specs.

Driver weight: 140 lbs
Tire Pressure: 28 psi
Vehicle Weight (with driver & 3/4tank fuel): 2243 lbs
LF: 509, RF: 473, LR: 648, RR: 613
Cross weight: 50%, Left: 51.6%, Right 48.4%, Front: 43.8%, Rear 56.2%

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2895/32217937084_fba42ac7f1_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/R5ZmeS)

[Scargo]

Really a great looking car with a lot of attention to detail. I wished I had of looked you up when I was in Dallas recently.
Would you say you balance is typical? Seems some were lighter in the front?

[TouchStone]

Really a great looking car with a lot of attention to detail. I wished I had of looked you up when I was in Dallas recently.
Would you say you balance is typical? Seems some were lighter in the front?

I'm not sure what typical is for this car. In the front I have a sway bar, ABS module, standard lead battery, steel LCAs, reinforced hood, AWIC radiator, speakers. I've also added sound deadener mat all around the cockpit, rubber undercoating to all the body panels and some of the aluminum panels. Hitting the 818kg mark was not a high priority for me so there are a lot of places where I could lose weight/mass.

[FFRSpec72]

Cross weights are right on, I assume you are not going to track the car a lot ?

[TouchStone]

It will see track time ;) Just not sure how much.

[TouchStone]

I took the 818 out to a local car show Monday night, I got to walk away with their Best of the Month award!

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4291/36009036035_fe194e061e_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/WRZHST) https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4324/35619815490_f072fbd083_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/WgASaQ)

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4312/35873993261_fd33e5f9ef_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/WE4Anc)

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4304/35876045851_9fa9a735a6_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/WEf7wF)

[Wayne Presley]

I took the 818 out to a local car show Monday night, I got to walk away with their Best of the Month award!

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4291/36009036035_fe194e061e_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/WRZHST) https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4324/35619815490_f072fbd083_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/WgASaQ)

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4312/35873993261_fd33e5f9ef_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/WE4Anc)

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4304/35876045851_9fa9a735a6_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/WEf7wF)


Very Cool!!!

[RM1SepEx]

Looks awesome! Congrats

[Frank818]

Great award! Well deserved!

Just noticed your rear tires are quite inside the fenders. You have 255s?

[turbomacncheese]

Sweet!

[flynntuna]

Well done! It validates your awesome build.

[wirenut]

That is too cool! Well deserved.

[TouchStone]

Great award! Well deserved!

Just noticed your rear tires are quite inside the fenders. You have 255s?

Yes they are 255s I also have 5mm spacers all around.

[Frank818]

I'm impressed, I have 265s without spacers and they barely fit, will probably rub (fender-wise).

[Mitch Wright]

Man your car looks great and a ride to be really proud of, congrats.

[TouchStone]

Time to move on to bigger and better projects!

For sale at: http://r.ebay.com/mFjASd

[longislandwrx]

nice you got the obligatory car show plaque. next stop is one of those creepy leaning dolls.

selling already? you didn't even get a full summer of driving out of it.

GLWS




edit:
"Hybrid 2.5L Subaru Boxster STI "

[TouchStone]

nice you got the obligatory car show plaque. next stop is one of those creepy leaning dolls.

selling already? you didn't even get a full summer of driving out of it.

GLWS




edit:
"Hybrid 2.5L Subaru Boxster STI "

I want to build another kit, maybe a 65 Coupe. Its taking up my garage and selling it would help fund the new project!

[Frank818]

I'm disappointed, your car looks really awesome. :( But in the end it's a matter of progressing in your fun and projects, so I support your sale.

[TouchStone]

More at https://www.flickr.com/gp/100094285@N03/8XkB68

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4453/36611753394_3c0ade0f02_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/XMfNKu)

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4436/36611754224_5921646c14_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/XMfNZN)

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4468/37065257950_f9dc0a1c4d_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Ytk8Ry)



https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4463/36611758524_63d8c9b5d5_h.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/XMfQgW)

[Wayne Presley]

Looks great Josh

[CdnCarNut]

I'm interested in how much you put into it (both hard cash and time) vs. how much you sold it for. It's generally accepted that all kits are money losers unless you can turn them over very efficiently.

[TouchStone]

I'm interested in how much you put into it (both hard cash and time) vs. how much you sold it for. It's generally accepted that all kits are money losers unless you can turn them over very efficiently.

That's difficult to answer. I think you need to decide whether you are building a kit as a hobby or as a business. I believe if your build it as a hobby then your time should not be factored into the price as its for enjoyment or a learning experience. If your trying to turn a profit you would need to come up with a build model that minimizes build time and parts cost while maintaining a high standard of quality. While the latter of these would be interesting to design I personally would not want to actually take part in the actual build/s.

To answer your question about my build cash cost plus time cost was around $55K-60K. Cash cost only $35K-$40K. Since I built it for fun and learning and got to do some autocross and driving afterwards I think it was well worth it. I should also mention that this kit introduced me to a number of great people and new friends; introduced me to autoX and track days; I'm now building a Spec Miata racecar and doing the build out myself; I also perform all the service on my daily driver. If you consider all this then I definitely came out ahead. :D

[DSR-3]

Like (most) race cars (or kit cars), don't expect a good $$ return on your investment- the fun factor in building and driving it is the best you can do.
I used to try to make myself feel better about my race cars by considering what the "arrive and drive" or rental types pay for a weekend. At those rates, you can justify a lot of the costs of building or buying if you do a even a few races per year. 'Agreed on the benefit of meeting great people along the way!

[Frank818]

To answer your question about my build cash cost plus time cost was around $55K-60K.

How did you factor in the time cost? 50/h? You built fast!! At that rate, my time cost alone is 165k! lollll

You really did an awesome job on the wrap quality, too bad I couldn't pay you to do mine. :)

[TouchStone]

How did you factory in the time cost? 50/h? You built fast!! At that rate, my time cost alone is 165k! lollll

You really did an awesome job on the wrap quality, too bad I couldn't pay you to do mine. :)

165K! Thats a 18 month 9-5 job! I just guesstimated the time at ~600hrs. It seems reasonable but I could be off by quite a bit. I stopped counting hours after the 2nd week.

[Frank818]

Yeah 1.5 years full time, at the minimum. Then if I take your way of calculation, I'm off the charts. lolll But that being said, your wrap is astonishing and the buyer has to take that into account. That work alone is worth a lot of money.
And yeah you did build fast! Sticking to H4 saves a lot of time.

[svanlare]

Loving the colors, and planning to try to wrap my car as well, so you and Frank are clearly inspirations to follow when I get to that step. On the black and orange, how do you apply the different colors? Would love any tips you have there on getting the seams right when you do that too.

[TouchStone]

Quick update on what I've been doing:

About a year and a half ago I bought a 92' Miata and have been building it out for Spec Miata racing. The build is now finished and I've been running the car mostly on HPDE track days. Last month tho we took it out for its first competition event a Champ Car endurance race at Harris Hills Raceway. During race 1 of 2 we had the engine blow out spectacularly, complete with fireball under the car. Our team spent the entire night successfully swapping the engine. On the next day, second race, we ended up 9th of 42 overall and 5th of 17 in our class. I'm super excited and looking forward to running more events.

I've got build photos and videos from various track events on my youtube channel.

https://www.amazon.com/photos/share/0OUqztB5Ganwn2DybZOOx04A8SlvsOu0DKbtWqGyyAQ (https://www.amazon.com/photos/share/P3f9CyZXym9bqZwBbLZuaTFSh2C0nP7yLEqY7hTNhaO)

https://www.amazon.com/photos/share/KAnF7WihjcKipGvPT7L7jj0KVCvZFmhMveYuGBr7sGC

Car on the day I picked it up. Paid about $1,600
97049

On grid for its first competition race.
97048


https://youtu.be/KUONaOqt_08?t=34