Zach's 818R Build Thread

[Zach34]

Production date was 11/8/2014. Since then I've had the donor tear-down, the holidays, and a competing project on a motorcycle delaying getting started on the car.

Kit options:
- 818R
- Bare frame
- Front race splitter
- Street windshield
- Door ducts
- 6-speed transaxle kit
- Wilwood pedal box
- Front canards

Donor: 2005 WRX STi, 135,000 miles, totaled due to interior fire resulting from theft

I built a Mk II Roadster way back in 2003 and got as far as doing a couple track days with it before realizing I wanted something more track-dedicated. I'm using my small amount of experience with the Roadster to form my plan for the car:

Engine: Relatively stock STi motor, rebuilt and upgraded with reliability in mind (dry sump, etc.). I know nothing about turbos and these motors, so got a lot to learn...
Trans: Rebuilt 6-speed from the STi, possibly with different gear ratios (I may change my mind and go for a 5-speed, still researching...)
Aero: Custom APR wing (likely the GT250 sized to my spec vice the GTC250 offered by FFR), plus the options above.

The build will basically be done in two phases. Phase 1 will be mock-up and test-fit, which is why I got the frame uncoated. The main focus here is modifying whatever I need to to make sure I fit in the car the best I can. I'm 6'3" with most of my height in my legs. The Roadster's legroom was a constant annoyance and there will be no holds barred when it comes to cutting and welding on the 818R frame to get the fit right. I will also modify what I need to for the transmission and mock up the rear/side body panels to fabricate a wing support. Phase 2 will commence with getting the frame powdercoated. Hopefully it will be mostly a matter of assembly from there.

Some pictures from the pick-up back in November are below. Very exciting to see the factory. It was the weekend they were getting back from SEMA, so I missed out seeing the Gray (old Red) car, but the Blue car was there. The pictures just don't do it justice. These cars in full race trim look incredible.

Here's a few pictures of the pick-up. Loooong drive from Norfolk.

371643716537166

[Zach34]

So I had done a little bit of research about the 6-speed option, enough to know what FFR had developed a kit for it by the time I ordered. I stopped my research there, so hadn't learned of all the other issues involved with the 6MT.

I learned about the frame interference when I dropped the engine in for test-fit.

3716737168

I'm sure FFR will eventually modify the frame to accomodate both transmissions, but in the mean time if I stick with this transmission I'll be borrowing heavily from Kurk818's approach here: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?11695-who-will-be-the-first-to-try-putting-the-sti-6-speed-tran-in&p=146410&viewfull=1#post146410

The determining factor will be what I decide for gear ratios. I was planning on a transmission rebuild regardless just due to wear (135,000 miles), so I'll have an opportunity to change gear ratios and final drive there, if possible, there.

[Zach34]

I'd been stressing over the seat choice since ordering the kit. I finally took a trip up to OG Racing yesterday and came back with this:

37169

It's the Racetech RT4009HR, wide version. It was the only one they had. I think it's the same model Chad Plavan has. I wish I could have tried the regular (narrow) verson, but the fit was so good on the wide I decided to go ahead and pull the trigger on it. I spent about 2 hours just sitting in a couple different Sparco and OMP seats. I really liked the OMP HTE-R, but the thigh bolsters were uncomfortable when making a motion like pushing the clutch pedal. The Sparco seats tended to lack lumbar support and didn't have the support around the rib-cage that I like. The Sparco that I liked the best was the Circuit II. Things that factored into my decision:

-Good lumbar support
-Not too wide (21" max along hips/legs, about 23" at shoulders to fit in the car)
-Comfortable clutching motion
-Good support on sides of torso
-Headrest area not extremely large since it will be up in the wind

If I had unlimited legroom in the car, I would have probably gotten the OMP and saved some money. But I had taken measurements of the footwell area and already had a good idea of where my legs would be - knees up and somewhat close to the steering wheel. The Racetech was just much more comfortable in that position. If I could have my legs straight forward the OMP would have been just as good.

First order of business was the broomstick test to try and get an idea of how much I will have to modify. Due the amount of room I have I couldn't get the front rollbar in the picture, but you can pretty easily interpolate it.

In both pictures, the seat is sitting flat and square on the floor with zero decline. This is NOT how it will be finalized, but I can't really reposition it until I remove the 3/4" slanted lateral brace above the sub belt mount on the frame. I used a piece of conduit to serve as my broomstick. In the first picture, the conduit was sitting on the front and rear rollbars without me in the car, so you can get an idea of where the front one is.

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Here's me in the car now. The conduit was a full foot above the front rollbar!

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Here's me scrunching down in the car so that the conduit once again rests on the front rollbar.

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Obviously, the seat will have to be reclined as far back as possible. I will probably have to cut whatever I can out of the seat foam and possibly cut out the entire floor to recess the seats down flush with the bottom of the car. I need every inch.

37175

Reclining the seats means taking away footroom area that I don't have to spare, so more cutting and welding will likely be needed to push the pedal box forward.

I think I can make it work. It's going to be a better fit than the Roadster was, that's for sure.

[Kurk818]

So I had done a little bit of research about the 6-speed option, enough to know what FFR had developed a kit for it by the time I ordered. I stopped my research there, so hadn't learned of all the other issues involved with the 6MT.

I learned about the frame interference when I dropped the engine in for test-fit.

3716737168

I'm sure FFR will eventually modify the frame to accomodate both transmissions, but in the mean time if I stick with this transmission I'll be borrowing heavily from Kurk818's approach here: http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/showthread.php?11695-who-will-be-the-first-to-try-putting-the-sti-6-speed-tran-in&p=146410&viewfull=1#post146410

The determining factor will be what I decide for gear ratios. I was planning on a transmission rebuild regardless just due to wear (135,000 miles), so I'll have an opportunity to change gear ratios and final drive there, if possible, there.

FFR's solution to the frame interference was to raise the transmission with a block. I was the first to buy the 2WD conversion adapter for the 6sp from them. They provided no instruction on how to go about making the 6sp work at that point in time. I ended up modifying the frame to allow the oil pan to sit lower, which i believe was the correct way to approach it. There is a thread that goes about the installation of the 6speed.

I have a fully functioning and driving STI 818S go kart. Currently working on buttoning up some details and putting body panels on.

[C.Plavan]

I'd been stressing over the seat choice since ordering the kit. I finally took a trip up to OG Racing yesterday and came back with this:

37169

It's the Racetech RT4009HR, wide version. It was the only one they had. I think it's the same model Chad Plavan has. I wish I could have tried the regular (narrow) verson, but the fit was so good on the wide I decided to go ahead and pull the trigger on it. I spent about 2 hours just sitting in a couple different Sparco and OMP seats. I really liked the OMP HTE-R, but the thigh bolsters were uncomfortable when making a motion like pushing the clutch pedal. The Sparco seats tended to lack lumbar support and didn't have the support around the rib-cage that I like. The Sparco that I liked the best was the Circuit II. Things that factored into my decision:

-Good lumbar support
-Not too wide (21" max along hips/legs, about 23" at shoulders to fit in the car)
-Comfortable clutching motion
-Good support on sides of torso
-Headrest area not extremely large since it will be up in the wind

If I had unlimited legroom in the car, I would have probably gotten the OMP and saved some money. But I had taken measurements of the footwell area and already had a good idea of where my legs would be - knees up and somewhat close to the steering wheel. The Racetech was just much more comfortable in that position. If I could have my legs straight forward the OMP would have been just as good.

First order of business was the broomstick test to try and get an idea of how much I will have to modify. Due the amount of room I have I couldn't get the front rollbar in the picture, but you can pretty easily interpolate it.

In both pictures, the seat is sitting flat and square on the floor with zero decline. This is NOT how it will be finalized, but I can't really reposition it until I remove the 3/4" slanted lateral brace above the sub belt mount on the frame. I used a piece of conduit to serve as my broomstick. In the first picture, the conduit was sitting on the front and rear rollbars without me in the car, so you can get an idea of where the front one is.

371703717137172

Here's me in the car now. The conduit was a full foot above the front rollbar!

37173

Here's me scrunching down in the car so that the conduit once again rests on the front rollbar.

37174

Obviously, the seat will have to be reclined as far back as possible. I will probably have to cut whatever I can out of the seat foam and possibly cut out the entire floor to recess the seats down flush with the bottom of the car. I need every inch.

37175

Reclining the seats means taking away footroom area that I don't have to spare, so more cutting and welding will likely be needed to push the pedal box forward.

I think I can make it work. It's going to be a better fit than the Roadster was, that's for sure.

That is my seat, but I have the non "Fat Boy" model :)

Here are my findings so you don't have to re-invent the wheel. You do not have to cut any bars. I thought I would, but didn't once I moved firewall back. My buddy who is 6' 2" sits in the car and loves it. I'm 5'11"

1. Keep in mind you can't have the seat right on the floor. You need room for your sub belt mounts on the floor. (I would suggest a Schroth 6 point belt http://www.schrothracing.com/competition/profi/profi-III ).
2. Make your mounts/ weld them in.
http://i.imgur.com/vuneknWl.jpg
3. I added around 10 degree's to the firewall bend and that enabled me to push back the firewall around 3". The I have seat reclined back too which helps.
4. After my first shake down, I still did not like how high I was sitting in pictures that were taken. So I bought this. http://racetech-usa.com/shop/cushions/superlow-base-cushion . It lowers you an additional 30mm!!! The stock cushion is ridiculously tall, remove it and you will see (velcro'd in). The super low cushion is 2 pieces and it fits fine. It lowered me down to where I want to be.

BTW- The Jury is still out on the 6 speed. The 5 speed is 80-100 pounds lighter and probably can handle the lightness of the 818R in 2 wheel drive. Not to mention 6th gear is useless in stock form, the 5th gear is basically the same. I have two Legacy GT 5speeds 4.11FD (beefier gears over stock WRX trans)

http://iharder.sourceforge.net/sti/WRX-STi-tx-ratios-transparent.gif

[STiPWRD]

Obviously, the seat will have to be reclined as far back as possible. I will probably have to cut whatever I can out of the seat foam and possibly cut out the entire floor to recess the seats down flush with the bottom of the car. I need every inch.

Have you considered raising the top roll bar?

[Zach34]

FFR's solution to the frame interference was to raise the transmission with a block.

Wow, that seems a little absurd to leave it at the severe angle in the picture. I agree with you. If I keep the 6-speed I'll be recessing it down like you did.

How do you like the gear ratios so far on your go-kart drives?

[Zach34]

That is my seat, but I have the non "Fat Boy" model :)

Here are my findings so you don't have to re-invent the wheel. You do not have to cut any bars. I thought I would, but didn't once I moved firewall back. My buddy who is 6' 2" sits in the car and loves it. I'm 5'11"

1. Keep in mind you can't have the seat right on the floor. You need room for your sub belt mounts on the floor. (I would suggest a Schroth 6 point belt http://www.schrothracing.com/competition/profi/profi-III ).
2. Make your mounts/ weld them in.
http://i.imgur.com/vuneknWl.jpg
3. I added around 10 degree's to the firewall bend and that enabled me to push back the firewall around 3". The I have seat reclined back too which helps.
4. After my first shake down, I still did not like how high I was sitting in pictures that were taken. So I bought this. http://racetech-usa.com/shop/cushions/superlow-base-cushion . It lowers you an additional 30mm!!! The stock cushion is ridiculously tall, remove it and you will see (velcro'd in). The super low cushion is 2 pieces and it fits fine. It lowered me down to where I want to be.

BTW- The Jury is still out on the 6 speed. The 5 speed is 80-100 pounds lighter and probably can handle the lightness of the 818R in 2 wheel drive. Not to mention 6th gear is useless in stock form, the 5th gear is basically the same. I have two Legacy GT 5speeds 4.11FD (beefier gears over stock WRX trans)

http://iharder.sourceforge.net/sti/WRX-STi-tx-ratios-transparent.gif

Now I feel fat.... But no, I have about a 32 inch waist and there is a bit of extra room at the hips, but the seat was just so much more comfortable around the thighs. I'm tentatively planning on adding a passenger seat down the road, which will obviously be the same model, but maybe I'll get a chance to test the narrow version then. I have a feeling I will prefer the wide version, though.

Thanks for the link to that cushion! The site doesn't list the RT4009HR as one of the seats that it fits, but if you say it fits I'll definitely get one of those. That will make things a lot easier. I was planning on trimming down the stock cushion, as I did notice it was plenty thick, but no need now.

I'm pretty much resigned to doing major surgery to the floor for two reasons: 1) get the seat another inch lower, and 2) make it easy to fit the Racetech seat brackets for easier mounting. It really won't be difficult with the bare frame. I managed to wedge the seat in with about a 15-20 degree recline, and it feels great and improved the way I fit in the car. I basically matched the seat-back angle to the angle of the firewall, and at this angle the headrest just touches the frame below the rollbar, so I think I can leave the firewall intact. Also, with the seat reclined like this, there will be room under the middle of it to fabricate a sub belt mount.

I'm waiting on the Wilwood pedal box. If I can push it forward and up just a few inches, I'll be pretty happy.

Chad, full disclosure. I'm going to imitate a lot of what you've done. Thanks for all your contributions to the forum!

That gear ratio graphic is handy. It looks like the 6-speed gives you a very high first gear at the expense of about 70 pounds (found a thread on NASIOC, 6-speed = 192 dry and 5-speed = about 122) http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showpost.php?p=23237759&postcount=5

Maybe it's time to see if I can find a Legacy 5-speed.

[Zach34]

Have you considered raising the top roll bar?

For about 10 seconds. It's tied into too many other bars. I'm fully confident in my welding ability, but I would rather get the seat reclined and lowered for ergonomic reasons.

[Zach34]

I'm sticking with the 6-speed. In case anyone else is struggling with their donor decision or which transmission to use, here is my reasoning:

6-speed pros / 5-speed cons:
1. I already have the 6MT
2. The 6MT is regarded as stronger than the 5MT
3. My 6MT (from 2005 STi) already has a torsen LSD. I verified this through the trans serial #.


5-speed pros / 6-speed cons:
1. The 5MT is 70 lbs lighter than the 6MT
2. The 5MT may have better gear ratios for racing over the 6MT

Bottom line, the benefit of saving 70 lbs and some gear ratios that MIGHT be better than the 6MT doesn't outweigh the cost and hassle of finding a 5MT, adding an expensive LSD to it, and then having to worry about the strength of it behind the STi engine. I'm quite a ways away from competitive racing and I have a lot more expensive stuff to buy for the build. It just doesn't make sense to pursue a 5MT.

With the major advantage of this car being lightness, I think the tendency is to overreact at the 70 lbs. I'll gladly add 70 lbs to gain more reliability.

The tipping point is the LSD. That almost makes it a no-brainer in terms of cost.

I do want to get the 6-speed rebuilt - likely calling Andrewtech for that. Hopefully most/all of the gears in my trans are in good shape.

I broke out the 6-speed conversion kit yesterday. It's pretty simple, basically very similar to the 5-speed process. The instructions were not included with the kit, but a quick call to FFR and they sent me the pdf. The instructions are very good. Only question is whether I do the conversion before or after the trans rebuild?

In other news, I got the Wilwood pedal kit yesterday. No instructions included (pretty sure a quick call will fix this, too), but the kit is very straight-forward. My only problem with the Wilwood box is that it lacks a positive back-stop for the pedals. There is a point where the linkage binds that kind of acts like a stop, but I don't want to rely on that. There is a lot of adjustment, too, and it's difficult to tell exactly how much clutch pedal travel will exist without hooking it up to the slave and testing. The good news is there appears to be enough room to move the pedal box forward 3-4 inches and up about 2 inches, which should put them in a good spot for me. Clearance between the brake pedal and OEM steering column is very tight - considering stripping the column down and removing the collapsible tube portions to ensure I can make the column dead-straight. This would mean positively securing both ends of the steering column somehow.

Anybody know if the master cylinders included with the Wilwood pedal box can be mounted upside-down? I don't see why it wouldn't work as long as it was bench-bled first.

[Silvertop]

You have lots of good reasons to stay with your 6MT. But the LSD isn't really the tipping point. It has been determined that the Quaife QDH3Y, which is identified for use in 6 Speed transmissions, and which is much cheaper (about $400) than the QDH1Y meant for the 5 Speeds, can also be used in the 5 Speeds. It will require going to male inner axle shafts. These are inexpensive, apparently only about $60. Just bought a QDH3Y for my 5 Speed. Not only are they cheaper, but they are a lot easier to find........

[STiPWRD]

Only question is whether I do the conversion before or after the trans rebuild?

If you bring Andrewtech the conversion parts with the trans I'm sure they can put them in no problem. I also considered the Quaife but decided against a torque biasing LSD in favor of a metal-on-metal plate style, so I'm planning on going with the Cusco LSD.

[Zach34]

So an update is long overdue.

I'm done with my frame modifications, and should have it out to powdercoat next week.

Here's a shot with everything cut out and nearly ready for new tube work. Notice the cut-out in the 1.5" tube in the dash area.

39611

New floor tubing in place. You'll have to stare at it a bit to see all the things I added - it's quite a bit. It was difficult to figure out some vertical support for the floor, since I had to remove the 3/4" tubes in front of the seats to get the lean-back I wanted. I feel extremely good with what I ended up with, though - two supports behind the seat and one that lies within the center console. No modifications at all to the firewall aluminum behind the seat. There will be considerable modification to the pedal-box aluminum.

39612

Again, notice the craziness behind the dash.

39613

And then there's this...

39614

The end result of all that behind-the-dash work is this:

39615

I moved the pedals about 4 3/4" forward, and 2 inches up. When the clutch pedal is fully depressed, the pedal pad is right above the rear LCA bushing. I also moved the pedals about 1.5-2 inches to the right, so that the steering column will now pass between the brake and clutch pedals. I moved the steering column bracket left about an inch to center it in relation to the seat. That bracket with the vertical oval cut in it is for the throttle pedal, which I positioned for the best heel/toe action I could manage.

The end result is the seat, steering wheel, and pedals are all now perfectly centered in relation to each other. I have about a 15-20 degree lean-back on the seat, and the bottom of the seat is flush with the underside of the car. I easily pass the broomstick test.

39616
39617

It feels awesome.

The floor in the footbox area will be raised up a bit to complement the raised pedal height - probably about 1.5 inches.

[Zach34]

I'm glad I test-fit the engine a couple times because it revealed what a huge pain it is to shoe-horn that thing in under the angled tubes above the engine compartment. I cut them out, welded in some tabs, and they now bolt in. I HIGHLY recommend this modification. It took me an afternoon and it is so much easier to install the engine/trans now.

39618
39619
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I also made the necessary modifications to clear the 6MT's oil pan:

39621

[Zach34]

I was thinking that I would go ahead and fabricate the support structure for the wing, but in the interest of not putting the cart too far in front of the horse, I scaled those plans back to just adding some tabs to the frame since I know I want the wing support structure to be bolt-in anyway. I'm planning on attachment points at the crossbrace that runs above the turbo, and here:

39622

[Zach34]

In other news, the long block (STI EJ257) is now in the custody of Element Tuning. Here's the rundown:

-Manley Pistons
-Element's forged rods
-Element's "big-valve" heads (+1mm on the intake), SS intake valves, Iconel exhaust valves, and mild porting
-Brian Crower 272 cams
-Element's proprietary block reinforcement. Phil is keeping the details a secret, but he claims dramatically reduced ring wear, and since this is a race motor I figured what the hell...
-Older Subaru water pump with cast impeller that Phil recommended, and upgraded oil pump

Fingers are crossed that the block and crank are in good condition, as the above is stretching the budget thin. During the engine tear-down, I noticed the oil is pretty dark. The spark plugs looked very good with the only exception being some blow-by evidence on one cylinder. The clutch had been recently changed, and the timing belt looked reasonably new.

Phil at Element says 8-10 weeks on the motor build which puts me well into summer for having the car finished. There's a good bit to do while waiting on the engine, though...

[Kurk818]

Very nice. Keep on the good work and innovations.

[fryguy]

I was thinking that I would go ahead and fabricate the support structure for the wing, but in the interest of not putting the cart too far in front of the horse, I scaled those plans back to just adding some tabs to the frame since I know I want the wing support structure to be bolt-in anyway. I'm planning on attachment points at the crossbrace that runs above the turbo, and here:

39622

These are some nice looking tabs. How are you making those?

[Zach34]

These are some nice looking tabs. How are you making those?

Thanks! Just careful measurements and a good belt sander. I used a bandsaw to rough-cut them, but an angle grinder would work just as well.

[C.Plavan]

Just an FYI- Save yourself a bunch of time. :)

http://www.tabzone.com/STORE-HOME-PAGE_c_74.html

[C.Plavan]

What race group/class are you going to run with?

[Zach34]

Thanks for the link! I thought about ordering from somewhere, but then I wanted wrap a couple of those tabs around two connected tubes, and, well... I get particular about small stuff...

I'm targeting ST2, since that seems to be the most logical place for us for now, but there's going to be some autocross and some track days before I get to the wheel-to-wheel stuff.

Frame, spindles, and all the brackets I could round up go to powder-coat tomorrow.

[C.Plavan]

Thanks for the link! I thought about ordering from somewhere, but then I wanted wrap a couple of those tabs around two connected tubes, and, well... I get particular about small stuff...

I'm targeting ST2, since that seems to be the most logical place for us for now, but there's going to be some autocross and some track days before I get to the wheel-to-wheel stuff.

Frame, spindles, and all the brackets I could round up go to powder-coat tomorrow.

Keep in mind the HP/Weight. Its hard to detune instead of adding HP. Frustrating also.

[Zach34]

Yeah, I talked to Phil at Element about the possible necessity of detuning eventually. I hope I'm right in assuming that that can mostly be handled with the turbo/tune, all stuff that I have yet to spend any money on.

[Sgt.Gator]

Any updates Zach?

[Zach34]

Kind of. The project is sort of on hold. I got the engine back from Element in November, but then it was all about getting the car to a condition where it could be moved to San Diego. The powdercoating turned out great. I have the radiator from Griffin (looks superb, but I have to re-locate the bottom hose connection). Steering is in. I gutted and welded the OEM rack. I made all the custom aluminum panels to enclose the extended pedal box - came out well. I also made 7075 1/8" thick aluminum side intrusion plates very similar to Chad's (totally ripped his idea off). Suspension is on with Cusco rear trailing arms. I picked up the redesigned front end when I got my trailer at FFR - totally unnecessary for an R, but I couldn't resist.

I literally just got in to San Diego a few days ago. I'm looking for a house/workshop. To say it's been frustrating is a huge understatement. San Diego housing is expensive to begin with, but the market has pretty much exploded over the last 6 months. There is almost nothing I can afford that has a garage big enough to accommodate my little operation. House flippers have taken over and everybody seems to be buying. The banks are fat and I think credit is almost as easy as it's ever been. I may have found a place today, but it's going to be a financial stretch, which will impact how much I can put into the car. The thought has crossed my mind of just shelving the project for a year or two, renting a small place, and falling back to my sport bike, but that would be demoralizing and still expensive since I would have to pay for storage of the car, tools, and my trailer. I'm determined to keep going. No way I'm giving up on the R, I think it's going to be great. I'll eventually post details once things settle down a bit, but that might not be for a couple months.

[wleehendrick]

I literally just got in to San Diego a few days ago. I'm looking for a house/workshop. To say it's been frustrating is a huge understatement. San Diego housing is expensive to begin with, but the market has pretty much exploded over the last 6 months. There is almost nothing I can afford that has a garage big enough to accommodate my little operation. House flippers have taken over and everybody seems to be buying. The banks are fat and I think credit is almost as easy as it's ever been. I may have found a place today, but it's going to be a financial stretch, which will impact how much I can put into the car.

Hi Zach,

Welcome to SoCal! I sympathize with you on the real estate market here. When I started my build I was in condo in Carmel Valley with no work-space; luckily a friend of mine offered garage space where I did my donor tear-down and started my build. Last year my wife and I bought a houseand when I got the 818 to a roller, I trailered her home (my body panels are still in a storage space). It's tight, working in half of a small 2-car garage, but manageable. You do what you have to!

I don't think easy credit is as big a factor like before the mortgage melt-down. We had a ream of paperwork and pretty stiff requirements to finance our home (below median, in pricey Encinitas). Investors with full cash offers are driving things up. I had a flier left on our doorstep from a real-estate agent describing how they have servers which give them access to buyers "behind the red firewall". Don't know how much is marketing BS, but they are explicitly catering to cash loaded Chinese. I do believe in a free-market, but that really bothers me.

You've probably found than looking south or east gets you more for your money, and that anything not considered a 'luxury' home built in the last several decades probably does not have generous work space. So, I think your best bet would be to look for older construction in the south or east county. Hope you find a place suitable with a reasonable commute!

Lee

[Zach34]

Hi Zach,

Welcome to SoCal! I sympathize with you on the real estate market here. When I started my build I was in condo in Carmel Valley with no work-space; luckily a friend of mine offered garage space where I did my donor tear-down and started my build. Last year my wife and I bought a houseand when I got the 818 to a roller, I trailered her home (my body panels are still in a storage space). It's tight, working in half of a small 2-car garage, but manageable. You do what you have to!

I don't think easy credit is as big a factor like before the mortgage melt-down. We had a ream of paperwork and pretty stiff requirements to finance our home (below median, in pricey Encinitas). Investors with full cash offers are driving things up. I had a flier left on our doorstep from a real-estate agent describing how they have servers which give them access to buyers "behind the red firewall". Don't know how much is marketing BS, but they are explicitly catering to cash loaded Chinese. I do believe in a free-market, but that really bothers me.

You've probably found than looking south or east gets you more for your money, and that anything not considered a 'luxury' home built in the last several decades probably does not have generous work space. So, I think your best bet would be to look for older construction in the south or east county. Hope you find a place suitable with a reasonable commute!

Lee

Thanks Lee. I think you're exactly right about the cash investors. I've toured a few properties that would have been a pretty big financial stretch for me to buy. Even so, I considered offering on a couple, only to find out some cash investor had come in with an offer at or above list. I feel pretty much helpless. I have the means to build this car, but apparently I don't have the means to put a roof over it? Absurd.

[flynntuna]

Welcome Zach, hang in there the market in San Diego is really tough now, lots of competition in a low inventory market. Lee gave some good advice, you need to have your loan money pre approved so you can have a chance against the cash buyers. You need to focus on how far your willing to drive to work, what area of the county you're interested in, and I'd suggest you find a good realtor. Someone who closes a min of 30 houses a year. They should have access to the homes that become available before they go on the MLS.

Good luck and happy hunting
George

[wleehendrick]

I've toured a few properties that would have been a pretty big financial stretch for me to buy. Even so, I considered offering on a couple, only to find out some cash investor had come in with an offer at or above list. I feel pretty much helpless. I have the means to build this car, but apparently I don't have the means to put a roof over it? Absurd.


You need to focus on how far your willing to drive to work, what area of the county you're interested in, and I'd suggest you find a good realtor. Someone who closes a min of 30 houses a year. They should have access to the homes that become available before they go on the MLS.

Zach, another approach to try is to look into FSBO properties; although a minority, more sellers are going that route, and that can get you a good deal, if you can find one yourself, are prepared to jump on it, and the seller doesn't have an unrealistically high expectation of what their property is worth.

We had the inside track on the home we purchased and negotiated directly with the seller, so the property was never listed or shown. The seller paid a nominal fee to a REA to represent both of us in the transaction, after we had already agreed on a price and basic terms. So there was no conflict of interest, but we had the benefit of making sure the paperwork was in order. The seller avoided paying a large commission and the effort of prepping and showing the property, and we got some price relief and had no competition to worry about. It ended up being a win/win situation, but we got lucky; we had been looking for a long time, knew the area and had a good idea on fair market value, and were able to come to an agreement.

It's hard to find those opportunities, though, especially being new to the area. If you need advice on local areas, traffic patterns, etc... just ask!

[Zach34]

Long past due for an update. Progress is still very slow, but I've chipped away at a couple things. Some pictures:

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The floor is nearly complete. When I re-structured the floor and extended the pedals forward, I positioned them a little higher to help with the angle of incline I wanted in the seat. The aluminum subfloor is raised to sit on top of the 1.5" square tubes that form the perimeter of the cockpit, effectively raising the floor just over 1.5". I added some aluminum channel bracing to give more support to the .090" aluminum top plate. Very sturdy, no oil-canning like the factory floor. Very happy with how it turned out.

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I'm getting close to being finished with the radiator plumbing. I went sort of bonkers with it. I wanted -20 AN everywhere (built my roadster with -16 and loved it), including the connections to the engine. The stock coolant crossover was pretty badly corroded and pitted on the o-ring surfaces, and I was leery of welding a -20 bung to the cast aluminum..... so I made one from scratch! Fun project. All made out of .060 aluminum sheet and 1.5" round tube, with some 1/2" plate for the o-ring surfaces. I made my own tubes to replace the factory supplied ones (used the supplied tubes as raw material). I'm almost finished machining my own -20 thermostat housing. Then it's just a matter of assembling a few hoses, which is fun but the fittings are crushingly expensive.

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[Zach34]

Custom coolant crossover:

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I also made my own crankcase vent crossover tube since the stock one was significantly rusty and integrated with some stuff I won't need. I'll be running a dry-sump oil system, no PCV valve, and I've already capped off the un-needed nipples on top of the block. I still have a coolant line to run to the purge tank, fuel lines, and all the plumbing for the turbo, but it should turn out much cleaner than the stock engine.

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[longislandwrx]

that looks fresh. much better than miles of black rubber.

[AZPete]

Nice work. No, amazing work!

[Zach34]

Thanks! Had some free time today to knock a couple other things out.

I finished machining my own -20 thermostat housing today. I haven't test-fit it yet, but it turned out great. Anybody know of a good place in San Diego to have small stuff anodized?

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I also re-located the outlet on the bottom of the radiator. With my steering rack slightly raised, there was just no way to make the existing outlet work. I'm pretty sure there's not enough room to raise the radiator high enough so that it would clear. The new outlet sticks straight down. A 90-degree -20 fitting will leave about 1/4 - 1/2 inch clearance above the underbody aluminum. This was a tough welding job, and stressful considering what the radiator cost.

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[longislandwrx]

http://symcoat.net/wp/ if you are not picky about the color, they can throw it in with another batch and get you a deal.

talk to Joe Kilduff. joe@symcoat.net

[Zach34]

Perfect! Thanks!

[Hindsight]

Looking very nice!

[Zach34]

Still here! Unfortunately not much of any progress. Life is getting in the way, but hoping to resume investment in the car within the next few months.

I haven't been completely dormant, though, and I've had a chance to dabble in some CNC work:

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I've also decided to heavily modify the driver's side of the frame for more elbow room, looking to start cutting out the existing tubes next weekend.

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[DanielsDM]

Nice work on the radiator mounts. Good to see another west coast R being built. Are you planning on wheel to wheel racing, time trials, etc...? What class?

[flynntuna]

Funny how "life" gets in the way, I get home from tired from work and I think should I go in the garage or jump in the pool.... More often than not the pool wins.

[Zach34]

Nice work on the radiator mounts. Good to see another west coast R being built. Are you planning on wheel to wheel racing, time trials, etc...? What class?

Thanks! Eventual goal is NASA ST2, but that's a long way off.

[DanielsDM]

Thanks! Eventual goal is NASA ST2, but that's a long way off.

I'm also building mine for NASA ST2. Also want to do WERC endurance racing. My original plan was to detune it to NASA ST3 (9lb/hp) for endurance racing since ST3 cars run in E0 in the WERC series. But then NASA changed ST3 to 10lb/hp and I don't know if I can (or want) to detune it that far <200 whp, so we may end up in the ES class.

[Zach34]

I'm also building mine for NASA ST2. Also want to do WERC endurance racing. My original plan was to detune it to NASA ST3 (9lb/hp) for endurance racing since ST3 cars run in E0 in the WERC series. But then NASA changed ST3 to 10lb/hp and I don't know if I can (or want) to detune it that far <200 whp, so we may end up in the ES class.

Yeah, detuning that far may be a hassle, plus, it seems this car has enough chassis to handle more power from what we've seen from the few on the track so far. I will have a lot of track days and some autox before I pursue a license for NASA, so I'm not too worried about targeting a specific HP number yet. I'll cross that bridge when I get there.

[Zach34]

Chipping away...

I made a tubing notcher for my fixturing table. It should allow me to make notches at compound angles. The frame modification project will be a good test for my design.

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I started cutting today, and made most of the bends I'll need in the new tube. Getting the notches and angles right will take a lot of work.

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I should be able to get the grinding done tomorrow and at least rough-cut the tubes. Very little spring-back in the tubes I cut.

[Zach34]

Got the first couple tubes tacked on. This little project does a lot to explain FFR's design choices with the frame - the square tube mixed with round, the peculiar tube nodes. It's easy to make something that looks nice in a 3D CAD model but is completely impractical to fabricate.

Good fitment so far. I have a lot more tubes to go. The bends protrude outwards exactly 5 inches. My measurements indicate that I'll have 1/4" to spare on the inside of the side sails and doors - a lot of empty space there...

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[Hindsight]

Nice work!

Have you done tubing fab before? Kinda looks like it. When I re-did my 818S roll-bar to make it higher, that was my first experience with tubing fab and I really enjoyed it. Very satisfying for some reason. I still don't understand how the guys do full cages in roofed cars where you have to weld around 360 degrees of tubing yet the tube is 1/4" from the roof.

[phil1734]

I still don't understand how the guys do full cages in roofed cars where you have to weld around 360 degrees of tubing yet the tube is 1/4" from the roof.

You typically either cut a hole in the roof and patch over it later, or build the cage 6" lower in the car with the tubes at the corners sticking out the bottom. Then once it's all welded you lift the cage up until it hits the roof and slip a spreader plate in underneath and attach the cage to the car.

[RetroRacing]

We cut the b pillar on the RX7 with a saws all, the A pillar at the roof, then install the cage, checking ever now and then for clearance. Makes it easy to install and weld, then weld the roof back on and finish the body work.

[Zach34]

Nice work!

Have you done tubing fab before? Kinda looks like it. When I re-did my 818S roll-bar to make it higher, that was my first experience with tubing fab and I really enjoyed it. Very satisfying for some reason. I still don't understand how the guys do full cages in roofed cars where you have to weld around 360 degrees of tubing yet the tube is 1/4" from the roof.

No but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night...

This is the first big tubing project I've done. I know I can weld it, so the challenge is the bend angles and coping. The 3D images back on post 39 are from Fusion 360. Incredible tool. I was able to print out 1:1 scale drawings of the cut angles for the tube ends and tape them onto the tubes to trace the cut line. Worked out very well. The middle horizontal tube connects to each of the ones in the above picture in the middle of the bend, so that will be a challenge to get a tight fit.

[Zach34]

Getting closer. Four more tubes to go.

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[Zach34]

The roll cage modifications forced me to ditch the 7075 aluminum panel I had installed to provide some additional intrusion protection (from shards of fiberglass) in the event of a side impact. At the cost of some considerable additional time/effort, I made 9 individual aluminum panels to fit in between the new tubing to fulfill the same purpose. The CAD design came in handy again. I did not design the new tubing with consideration for these aluminum panels, so some compromises had to be made. Two of the panels required bends, so 7075 was not an option for those. I ended up using 6061. It's still 1/8" thick, so it's not drastically weaker than the 7075, and considering my body is no longer smashed directly against the inside of the frame tubes, I think it's a good solution. They are attached with some pretty trick pre-made roll cage weld-on tabs.

All the tubing is tacked in and some of it is finish-welded. It's coming out nice, but I'm still nervous to test-fit the body panels, which will involve a lot of trimming on the fiberglass.

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[Zach34]

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[Canadian818]

Awesome work Zach!

[Shawn818c]

Great work! I wish you lived closer so you could fab a roll cage for my 818c!!

[Zach34]

All the panel tabs are tacked in place now. Still need to remove the paper cut patterns I glued on the outside.

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Progress on the vacuum regulator adapter. The steel rectangle is just the fixture for holding it in the mill. It's hard to make heads or tails of it from the picture, but it will make sense soon. Won't take long to finish it at all as soon as I can jump back on the machine...

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[Zach34]

Trying to figure out what to do about the powdercoating. I'd like to just get the whole frame stripped and re-coated, but I think the cost would be prohibitive, and I don't know if the powdercoating shop would even want to take on that big of a stripping job. I think they can coat over the existing powder, but I worry about the quality/finish.

Anybody have experience trying to re-coat a frame that was modified or repaired?

[Bob_n_Cincy]

Anybody have experience trying to re-coat a frame that was modified or repaired?

I did a 2 coat powder.
First a chrome powder.

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Then a coat of translucent blue

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Turned out great
Bob

[Zach34]

Man that blue pops! I got a quote locally. It's expensive, but not as bad as I feared. I'm weighing stripping all the aluminum panels and silicone off for a re-powdercoat job vs just masking and spraying the bare areas with something like this:

http://www.eastwood.com/extreme-chassis-black-gloss-finish-aerosol-or-quart.html

Anybody ever used that stuff? (Rustoleum and VHT have their own versions, too)

[Zach34]

Vacuum regulator adapter. Replaces oil fill tube on the engine.

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[RetroRacing]

We made one of those as well, but be carefull, we are deleting ours (check out my comments on the R page)

[Zach34]

Fitting body panels before I re-work the frame on the passenger's side to match the driver's side.

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Extreme pucker factor verifying the side sails would still fit. Worked out as expected. Big relief. I must have measured 20 times...

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Dzus!

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Pulled the rear bumper back to give me about 1/2" clearance behind the trans from where FFR had mounted it for shipping. Thinking of adding rear "nudge" protection like others have...

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Welded the mounting plates for the new front fenders to the front subframe. Good chance to practice TIG.

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Retro, echoing from the other thread... thanks for pointing out the issue with running the vacuum regulator. Probably saved me big time. I suppose I'll just use the adapter to attach a vent line instead of the regulator since it's a standard -12 o-ring boss.

[longislandwrx]

looking tight.

[Zach34]

Started fiberglass modifications on the engine cover.

Some voids in the gel coat in these tight contour areas. Not so bad on flatter sections.
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Both of these corners were mostly gel coat, maybe 1 to 1.5 layers of fiberglass underneath. Again, the flatter sections were much better.
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I took it down to the fiberglass to better adhere to the new cloth I will lay down to bond the engine cover winglets (below). The gel coat formed most of the contour here. Not much fiberglass underneath. There was a lot of wavyness in the gel coat here anyway, so it would have needed filler work even if I wasn't bonding in the little winglets from the engine cover. Definitely not trying to build a show car here, but it was just a little too much for me to ignore.
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Some of the stuff I'm using, all West System from the local West Marine. I experimented with the 406 filler (Colloidal Silica) on some scrap before starting. Seems to work well and it's not terribly expensive. You want to stop adding filler just before it turns to a peanut butter consistency. If it's too thick, it cures hard and doesn't seem to adhere to the fiberglass as well. A jelly consistency remains very flexible after curing. It sands well enough, but you wouldn't want to use this as a body filler. I'll use Rage Extreme over the new fiberglass to blend into the gel coat.
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Thickened epoxy applied. Next is 2-3 layers of cloth, then the Rage.
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What a mess.
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Just started to prep to join these two panels. I cut out the hardware for the hinge. I'm going to imitate exactly what John (Hobby Racer), just with slightly different products. I'll probably end up cutting the lip off all the way around the panel and use the huge amount of foam weatherstripping included in the kit
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Design nearly complete on v1.0 of a transmission mount for the 6MT (may also work for 5-speed) that should lower it a little less than an inch to try to level the engine a bit better. The wacky design is due to the flatter angle of the trans no longer being parallel to the angle of the point on the frame it attaches to. I'm not 100% happy with it, but maybe I'll feel better once I cut a prototype. Would be a great job for a 3D printer...
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[DanielsDM]

Design nearly complete on v1.0 of a transmission mount for the 6MT (may also work for 5-speed) that should lower it a little less than an inch to try to level the engine a bit better. The wacky design is due to the flatter angle of the trans no longer being parallel to the angle of the point on the frame it attaches to. I'm not 100% happy with it, but maybe I'll feel better once I cut a prototype. Would be a great job for a 3D printer...
80435

Looks good Zack. I'm going to do stiffer mounts of some sort and it's good to see other peoples ideas. Thanks for posting.
It looks like the two dark gray brackets are made from bend sheet/plate, steel?. Are these existing parts or will they be fabbed also? If so how are you going to do it?

[Zach34]

Yes, the two dark gray parts will be cut from 13-gauge 2-inch square tube. I haven't modelled the bushings yet, but they will be cast from liquid polyurethane. The bushing inner diameter is only about 30mm. I would have liked them to be bigger, but no way to do that without raising the mount in this design. Thinking of using a softer polyurethane grade to allow for SOME flexibility.

If I'm visualizing things right, the jacking force of the pinion on the differential ring gear presses down on the transmission mount and pulls up on the engine mounts, right? Trying to factor that in

[Zach34]

Been working on the car a bit more lately. Things are starting to look up on my ability to make progress over the summer. I'm going to tackle the body, finish my frame modifications, do paint, then circle back to drivetrain.

The body is.... challenging, although I'm not making it any easier.


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Fenders are about the same length, so that's a win! Don't mind the weird curvature-look of the second picture - they weren't sitting at the same angle.


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Dzus adapters for the top/front fender mount.


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I made adjustable rods to replace the steel bars you have to bend for the front fenders. Lighter and easier to adjust. These are aluminum tubes with steel rod ends. Maybe chromoly tubes would have been better...

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Joining the rear deck lids. Inspired by Hobby Racer's method. I made some panel clamps that allowed me to pretty firmly and very evenly clamp the two pieces together, leaving a 3/16" gap. You can see two of the clamps sitting on the panel in the first picture. I made 6 clamps total. I used them to hold the panel so I could epoxy those little 3-inch strips of fiberglass in place that I cut from scrap material. I simply laid new mat over top of those. I have since laid a layer of glass mat on the topside as well. Results are good. I'll shoot a picture of the topside for the next post.

Doing a lot of work to the nose to make it dzus-removable. More to follow.

[Hobby Racer]

Zach, your fiberglass work is looking great. Real messy isn't it!

[Zach34]

The dust... there's so much of it. It's everywhere. And I really haven't done that much sanding!

[Zach34]

Topside of the deck lid:

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Nose work for dzus fasteners. About halfway done:

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[Wayne Presley]

Nice work there

[Zach34]

Update! Nose dzus attachment:

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First time I've worked with these fasteners. They hold tigher than I expected. I thought with the spring they would feel sort of loose, but no, not at all. Of course, you can adjust the springs a little bit, too.

[Zach34]

Transmission mount fabrication proceeds. I've relented to some slight modification of the frame (just a little bit of cutting for clearance). More to follow once I have the whole thing fabricated. This is my 3rd design. The goals are to lower the 6MT allowing for a flatter trans/engine angle, allow fore-aft adjustment, and still incorporate a bushing. The arrow points toward the front of the car.

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The steel clevis was probably the most difficult fabrication challenge. So far so good.

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[Zach34]

Working on finishing up the front fender mounts. They definitely take some significant pushing/pulling to get good symmetry. With some creative bracketry, I think they will end up looking good.

I was having a tough time figuring out why the bottom/front of the fenders didn't seem to sit the same, then I pulled the bottom mounts to check their symmetry...

When matching the inner brackets up to each other...
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The outer brackets aren't even close to the same place. The brackets are slightly twisted relative to each other. The tubes are even different lengths/angles. This was one of the first nose retrofit kits, so I'm sure FFR has ironed out the kinks by now. The brackets need to be flat across the bottom because the splitter (which must be flat) will attach to both the inner and outer brackets. I'll have to re-weld them...
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[STiPWRD]

Is the main advantage of dzus fasteners quick removal (1/4 turn)? I've never worked with them either but noticed a few R builders using them. Functionally, they look very similar to these rivet nut plates, which I've also used for attaching fiberglass to fiberglass:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-4-20-Fiber-Lock-Nutplates-Rivets-Rat-Rod-Hot-Custom-Race-Sprint/252298834018?hash=item3abe2eb062:g:7ZQAAOSwB4NWzg1 a:sc:USPSPriorityMailSmallFlatRateBox!20176!US!-1

[longislandwrx]

i like your new mount design more, looks like you could use some kartboy diff bushings if you don't want to fabricate something.


https://www.rallysportdirect.com/part/transmission-and-differential-bushings/kar-kb-003-diff-kartboy-rear-diff-crossmember-bushings-standard-set

[Zach34]

Is the main advantage of dzus fasteners quick removal (1/4 turn)? I've never worked with them either but noticed a few R builders using them. Functionally, they look very similar to these rivet nut plates, which I've also used for attaching fiberglass to fiberglass:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-4-20-Fiber-Lock-Nutplates-Rivets-Rat-Rod-Hot-Custom-Race-Sprint/252298834018?hash=item3abe2eb062:g:7ZQAAOSwB4NWzg1 a:sc:USPSPriorityMailSmallFlatRateBox!20176!US!-1

Yes, quick removal, and they also have a semi-locking benefit. They are probably not going to vibrate loose. The cost in terms of fabrication time/effort is probably outweighing any benefit, if I'm honest. I'm certainly not claiming that I'm doing things the "right" or "logical" way, but it is nice to be able to quickly remove/install the panels and it's a fun fabrication challenge. Besides, I need time to save up for dry sump, turbo, wheels, and aero parts, so the dzus fastener and bodywork projects are filling up that time without costing a fortune.

Those fiberlock plates look like a great solution. Thanks for the link! That's actually got me thinking about what I want to use to mount the splitter.

[Zach34]

i like your new mount design more, looks like you could use some kartboy diff bushings if you don't want to fabricate something.


https://www.rallysportdirect.com/part/transmission-and-differential-bushings/kar-kb-003-diff-kartboy-rear-diff-crossmember-bushings-standard-set

Oh man, those bushings look like they would be about perfect if the inner diameter matches the big holes in the frame I'm using. Alas, I've already machined molds for my own. Hope to pour them today or tomorrow.

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I have high hopes. If everything turns out well I may be able to fabricate a few more of them...the transmission mounts, that is.

[Zach34]

Bushings came out well. Pictures later. I have one more component to machine for the trans mount, then test fit.

Work continues figuring out the front end. I like that FFR provided slots for the front fender brackets. The problem is there's no accompanying side-to-side adjustment for the hood pins, so I made some.

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Also re-welded the front fender lower brackets to make them mirror images of each other. I really like FFR's design of all the front fender brackets for the new nose. All the adjustability makes it easier to push/pull the fenders in place.

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[Sgt.Gator]

I love your setup table!

[Zach34]

I love your setup table!

Thanks! It's one of the Strong Hand Build Pro tables, and it is my favorite thing in the shop. They have all kinds of different sizes and options, and they continue to add to the fixturing accessories. I use it for more non-welding projects than I would have ever predicted. Just the fact that it is a flat/true surface comes in handy all the time. I could go on and on about it.

[Zach34]

The body is coming together. Dzus brackets for the rear fenders at the crossmember:

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The front fenders have been difficult, but I am overcoming. The rear of the front fenders presented the most challenging bracket-making problem. The fenders are not symmetrical (this is the new nose), so I felt slotted brackets were required to give myself the best chance of getting the hood to fit.

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Trying to figure out the windshield cowl. It is resting on the round tube at the top, yet there is a good 1" gap between the bottom flange and the frame where it would ideally attach. On the S, the flange attaches directly to the square tubes under the hood. Not sure I've seen any other R builders specifically address this.

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Finally, the wing is here! Very exciting. These APR wings are super nice. I'm envisioning a wing mount system that will incorporate a hinge for the rear of the engine decklid. I know that sounds confusing, but it works perfectly in my mind. The joined decklid pieces are going to be too cumbersome to lift off and put back on by one person without constantly slamming it into the rollbar tubes. The hinge weight should be minimal with the wing structure providing all the support.

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[Hobby Racer]

Trying to figure out the windshield cowl. It is resting on the round tube at the top, yet there is a good 1" gap between the bottom flange and the frame where it would ideally attach. On the S, the flange attaches directly to the square tubes under the hood. Not sure I've seen any other R builders specifically address this.

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I had the same issue. I just cut off the lip on the bottom of the cowl and made simple brackets to connect with the frame.

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Finally, the wing is here! Very exciting. These APR wings are super nice.

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They are quality pieces. I have the GT-250 67", looks like you got the same!

[Zach34]

Thanks for those pictures of the cowl - just what I was looking for. Looks good.

Yep, 67" wing. Anxious to start on the support structure for it.

[Zach34]

More progress. Body is coming together. Remaining items:

-enlarge side vents
-fabricate wing mount
-integrate engine cover hinge to wing mount
-cut out hood vents
-fabricate splitter

Most of the body ended up lining up reasonably well, about a 1/4" off here and there, but all the slotted brackets I made helped a lot. Most ended up not needing more than about 1/8" adjustment off center. The one big exception was the rear deck lid. I don't have a good picture showing the problem, but there was an irreconcilable tapered gap between the rear edge of the deck lid and the top of the rear bumper panel. There was no gap on the passenger side, and about 1/2" on the driver side. It was as if the entire passenger side sail was shifted forward 1/2", or the driver's side rearward 1/2", take your pick. Both side sails were lined up exactly 5/8" back from the frame as directed in the manual and the front fenders/nose actually lined up rather well. I was very careful to make sure the two engine deck lid pieces were evenly-spaced when I bonded them together. There was no way to shift the side sails forward or rearward without causing significant problems at the nose. I ended up trimming 1/2" off the rear edge of the engine deck lid on the passenger's side and tapering the cut to zero toward the driver's side. Hard to explain, a picture is better:

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I don't need perfect panel alignment for a race car, but a full half inch was too much to overlook. Plus, by trimming it there, it lined up on center and actually looks more symmetrical. Here's how it looks after the trimming:

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And here's with the rear deck pins installed. Notice how the deck is pretty much dead-on center, even after taking that huge wedge-shaped slice out of the rear edge. The gaps on the sides are parallel and pretty good.

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Hood pins:

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One of the brackets I made for the rear decklid Aerocatch pins, before drilling the hole for the pin. I know it looks weird. Rather than spend a couple days making 2-axis adjustable slotted brackets, I made a bracket that holds a simple flat piece of aluminum into which the Aerocatch pin is installed. If for some reason I need to adjust the position (very unlikely), I can just replace the simple aluminum piece.

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The bracket for the center pin for the rear decklid, yet to get a hole for the pin.

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I also installed the door cutaway's. These went in rather easy. I bonded/fiberglassed them in from the rear. I rough-cut the openings before bonding, then used some air tools and sanding blocks to grind/shape them to size after bonding. Happy with how they turned out.

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The wing mount is going to be pretty cool. Hopefully I'll have pictures within the next week.

[Hobby Racer]

Looking great!

Body work is time consuming and messy, but its very rewarding when it all comes together and looks good.

I really like how you made the square tubes near the center of the roll hoop removable, wish I had thought of that when I was at that stage.

[Zach34]

Thanks. The removable tubes, like most of the good ideas on this build, came from this forum. I've had the engine in and out 3 or 4 times. Can only imagine what a pain it would be with those welded in place.

[Zach34]

Designing in my head.... head hurts now....

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Doing all this with thin-wall chromoly tubing, for no particular reason other than to just get some experience working with it. The above is 1.25" diameter, 0.065-wall. Bends are about 10-11 degrees. The tubes that will connect these to the frame will be 1" diameter, 0.058-wall.

[Zach34]

Made good progress this weekend. The wing mount "sub-frame" is pretty much done. Came out very well. It's relatively light due to the thin-wall tubing.

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[Zach34]

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[Zach34]

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Next is obviously the uprights to the actual wing. They will be 1/2" thick aluminum, but with a lot of material removed. Planning on making a plywood template to capture the location first. Tentatively planning on machining them if I can figure out how to fixture such large parts.

I may put the uprights on the back-burner, though. I need to get the body to paint ASAP. Checklist for paint prep is:

-passenger side rollcage modification
-splitter
-side scoops
-exterior lights

I got FFR to make me a set of the big side vents that Wayne used on the Gray/Orange car!! Very excited about that. Many thanks to Wayne Presley and Dave Correia and Tony Zullo at FFR for being so helpful.

[Rob T]

This looks really great. You have some serious fab and welding skills. Can't wait to see it finished.

[STiPWRD]

Lots of attention to detail and some great looking welds.

[Mitch Wright]

Nice work Zach.

[AZPete]

Very nice work, for sure. In a perfect world, you'd live next door to me.

[Zach34]

Thanks for the kind words! I've been busy at work. Not a lot of progress lately. Quick update:

1/2-inch plywood splitter. After some research and advise from folks on this forum, I decided wood would be a better/cheaper/safer option than carbon fiber, especially having access to a CNC router. I made it a little too big. Probably going to trim a couple inches off. Anybody have any resources for determining splitter size/stick-out?

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Made some upright mock-ups out of plywood to confirm wing height and location of the mounting holes relative to the new frame structure. These were scanned (by my home printer/scanner, no less - worked great!) into PDF files, which I used in Inkscape to create a vector file for the hole locations, which I then imported into Fusion to design the actual uprights:

(Disregard my disaster of a garage...)

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Unfortunately I ran into an unexpected problem. Although it's difficult to see in the picture, the wing is pretty crooked. I built the wing support frame structure using the rear bumper as my reference for location of the tubes. After a lot of measuring and sighting, it turns out the driver's side of the rear bumper is about 3/4" lower than the passenger's side due to asymmetry in the panel molds, or at least how the panels came out of the molds.

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I added two more adjustable-length tubes to correct it. You will have to compare to the pictures above to find the new tubes.

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Oh, and the design for the uprights.

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[lsfourwheeler]

That splitter would be awesome if you plan to go to pikes peak! How did you make all the threaded ends for the adjustable tubes? My college competition team has done these frequently using a lathe, but it takes time to do all of them.

[Zach34]

That splitter would be awesome if you plan to go to pikes peak! How did you make all the threaded ends for the adjustable tubes? My college competition team has done these frequently using a lathe, but it takes time to do all of them.

Oh man, $6 each from Summit! Can't beat that compared to all the time it will take turning and threading them on a lathe. Link below to the ones I used. Just make sure you are buying the right ones for your tube wall thickness.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/fkb-1906

[Sgt.Gator]

Pegasus has them in metric if your trying to stay metric.

[Mitch Wright]

Here is another source to add to your list. https://www.aa-mfg.com/product-category/nuts-and-spacer-bushings/

[Zach34]

Decided to have the pedestals waterjet-cut. Pretty happy with the result.

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[Mitch Wright]

Beautiful work Zach.

[Rob T]

That is some great work. You have some serious skills.

[Mechie3]

Lots of good stuff going on in this thread! Like fab of the wing mount.

[Zach34]

Hope this works...

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If you are curious, it's all West System epoxy fiberglass. I used their 404 High Density Adhesive Filler underneath the aluminum tube/plate. It's supposed to be preferred for bonding metal hardware on boats. First time I've used it, so we'll see, but I know the epoxy resin bonds well to the fiberglass panels. Just one layer of fiberglass over top of the aluminum.

[Mitch Wright]

Zach, curious how heavy is your one piece deck? I gave some thought to doing the same when building my car, my fear was the combined pieces would be hard to get on and off by myself more so because of the bulk than the weight. I believe Retro has done something similar and have want to ask the question.
As always beautiful work

[Zach34]

The weight is not bad, even with the aluminum/epoxy stiffening. Your fear is correct - the bulk is the problem, especially negotiating the rollbar tubes that extend rearward. That's why I'm designing a hinge in the wing mounts. If you look carefully at the pictures in post 101, you'll see the small brackets in the inside "elbow" of the wing supports. Those will hold simple ball bearings. This weekend's project is to design and possibly start machining the arms that will attach to the top/rear of the deck lid and connect to those bearings. I'll probably use a simple prop-rod to hold it up.

The advantages are:
1. the entire rear deck can come up with only 3 pins to fiddle with
2. you don't have to set it down anywhere
3. it will be faster/easier to access the entire engine

The disadvantage, though, is huge - it's taken an incredible amount of time and effort to design and fabricate a solution that I like. I don't think it's logical for a true race car, but that's one of the many reasons I'm backing off my original goal of racing this thing. It will probably be more of a track day toy with racing potential.

[Mitch Wright]

As with all that you are doing looking forward to seeing your solution.
Also never say never, I built my car to race but have been offered drives by various teams which has provided my fix. Plus really being honest with myself I have been racing for 51 years and not sure I want to work that hard. I have been having a bunch of fun with track days and Time Trials. I figure if the car breaks I load it up and take it home to fix it at my leisure then play with it again. With all that said and looking at the new NASA ST rules a race or 2 could very well be in the cards this year at NCM because it is easy. That will be determined by house projects my wife comes up with, my energy level (Starting to reenergize now that it has slowed down) and my Falcon project. I do have the car back home to start working on front flairs so I can put the 235's back on the front.
Sorry for the ramble, enjoying your build and looking forward seeing completed and on track.

[Zach34]

No, I appreciate the thoughts. I'm the exact opposite of you - a complete amateur with racing. I need to get to a track more often and just find guys like you to observe. With all the time and $$ I'm putting into this thing, the thought of going wheel to wheel in it and probably banging it up is becoming less palatable. You could say "don't sweat the small stuff" and just get it done, but with so few of these 818Rs out on racetracks I'm liking the idea of scaling my ambitions back and just making it a nicer car - which is what I'm predisposed to anyway.

For racing, Spec Racer Ford may be in my future. It's probably more inline with what I want to budget for racing, anyway.

[Aero STI]

I've wanted to merge the two rear pieces into one for at least a year. Great work!

[Zach34]

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I've got to stop fooling around in the machine shop and pick up the pace on this thing...

[Zach34]

Most of February was lost to job commitments and some nice vacation time, but I did get the hinge parts welded and assembled for a test. I'm very happy with the result. The deck lid is very stiff and easy to open one-handed from either side. I definitely added a little weight, but less than I expected, and the results are worth it.

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[lsfourwheeler]

Those parts are awesome!

[longislandwrx]

very cool concept.

[DanielsDM]

I like the wing mounts. Nice work.

[Brd.Prey]

I'm jealous of your welding. Wish my beads looked like that!

[Zach34]

Slow progress. Been busy at work a lot over the past couple months. Also took some vacation. Made a little progress recently.

The rear hood is finally coming together. I've had a lot of problems getting it to fit without ridiculous gaps (3/4"+) and mismatched curvature. I got in a hurry and disassembled it to start on other little body projects before taking any pictures. I'll circle back and post once it's back together. Overall I'm glad I made the hinge. It's working well and will be tons easier than lifting the panels around the roll cage 10 times a day at the track. I do have a picture of the delrin spacers I made to help match the hood's curve with the fenders/rear. These are attached with nylon screws.

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Bonded in the new side vents. Very excited about these. Mounted them the same way I did the front door vents. I still need to add a couple layers of fiberglass mat to the backside for additional strength.

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[Ajzride]

Where did you get the buckets for the door cutouts and side vents? If you posted it, I missed it, where they hand fabricated or purchased?

[Hobby Racer]

Bonded in the new side vents. Very excited about these. Mounted them the same way I did the front door vents. I still need to add a couple layers of fiberglass mat to the backside for additional strength.

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Wow, those rear vents look even deeper than mine :D. After you cut the opening out they should let in a TON of air. Are those from FFR? I don't see that version on their parts site.

[Zach34]

I sweet-talked FFR into making me a set. I hope I'm not creating a problem for them by posting. :D

They made two sets out of carbon fiber for Wayne Presley's car. He installed one set on his gray/orange 818R and installed the other set on one of his customers' cars along with some very nice custom fender flares that you can find pictures of somewhere on this forum. Apparently they are very difficult/costly to make to the point where FFR decided not to try and mass-produce them. Mine are made out of fiberglass, which I think is easier/cheaper than the carbon fiber. Carbon is unnecessary, especially for the way I wanted to mount them.

The door vents should be available on FFR's parts website.

I'm still not decided on what to use the vents for. I'm 90% sure I'll go AWIC, so the options are intake, oil cooler, trans cooler? Hmmm...

[biknman]

Just an FYI I love Factory Five but they kind of screwed me on this one. I asked Wayne where he got the side rear quarter panel scoops he sent me to a POC at Factory Five they gave me a P/N of 81149 so I ordered them took forever to get ended up in a logistical /payment snafu on FFR's part and when they showed up they where the door scoops P/N 80849/50 which I got with my 818r kit :-(
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Because of how much a pain in the arshe it was try to get the scoops in the first place I just let it go ;-/ Guess it's the old soldier in me, use to taking it as hard as they can give it and not complaining and soldiering on. ;-P

So if any body needs a set of “DOOR” scoops I have an extra set I don’t need I'll let them go for price of course and shipping.

Thanks Zach34 didn't mean to take over your thread.

Dave

[Zach34]

No worries. Yeah, I ended up talking to Tony Zullo to get the right part on order. It took several weeks to get them, which I was fine with considering it's not a part that they want to make or stock regularly. Apparently it took them a few tries to get the layups to come out of the molds in good shape. They look great, though. I didn't hit any voids prepping them for attachment or when cutting the holes.

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I do have one problem with the way I decided to bond them in - I'll have to figure out how to blend the front edge of the new vents, just behind the doors. Can anyone recommend a filler, process, or how-to video that would help me do this? I have some Rage Gold body filler, but I have never used that stuff and I don't know if that's the right stuff for this job - I'm basically trying to blend a 1/8" step into a curve. Alternatively I could just cut away the last bit of red on the fenders behind the door and just have a weird-looking recess there. This is probably too much effort expended on aesthetics for a race car, but if there's an easy way to make it look better I want to do it.

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I also whipped up a design for the exhaust tip so I could locate and cut a hole for it. I took inspiration from a Stainless Works through-body tip design, and made it work for an oval tube.

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[Zach34]

Back from a couple weeks of vacation.



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Hm, what do we have here?....

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[aquillen]

This is going to be cool. Eyes are glued... ;)

[Zach34]

I've had one of the busiest summers at work that I've had in a long time. In the background I have been working another ambitious project. I'm not 100% confident in what the results will be. I hope to lay up all the fiberglass this week or next weekend.

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[Zach34]

Almost forgot, I got a 3D printer!

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[Hobby Racer]

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Those are going to work really well. Can't wait to see the final result.

[aquillen]

Those are going to work really well. Can't wait to see the final result.

Totally agree - looking forward to your composite parts.

[Jetfuel]

Pink foam is the way to go for creating molds for fiberglass parts.
Painting the mold with latex house paints keeps the resins from melting the foam.
Also looking for the final product.

[Zach34]

Pink foam is the way to go for creating molds for fiberglass parts.
Painting the mold with latex house paints keeps the resins from melting the foam.
Also looking for the final product.

That's a good tip. I did a test and the epoxy-based resin I'm going to use (West System) does not melt the foam. I suspect polyester-based probably will. I've become a big fan of the epoxy stuff. Low odor, more versatile. Only downside is the cost.

[Zach34]

What a mess!! These pictures are from a few months ago. Busy fall. Little progress. Pictures of current work coming soon. I would definitely do a gel/release agent if I did it again.

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[Santiago]

Loving the build so far Zach!

One thought; if you're going through the expense of using epoxy resin (which I love), you might consider using cloth rather than mat. The finished product will be stronger and you can start to find ways to reduce the resin ratio in the finished product (making them lighter as well). A 6oz cloth works pretty well for most projects like your hood vents.

Soooo glad to see more and more folks fully ducting their radiator - you're going to help lower drag a good deal. Well done!

[Zach34]

Thanks! The first layer was cloth. The mat is quite a bit cheaper than the cloth, so that's why I used it for building thickness.

I wasn't sure how I would like them based off the foam molds, but now that I've been able to test-fit, they are going to look pretty good. I've figured out how I'm going to mount them. Next I have to figure out how to mount the fans inside. I should have considered that when I made the molds. If I had molded in some flats for the fan frame, things would be a lot easier. I've already done a lot of body filler work on the inside to try and smooth it out. It's a tough project.

I forgot to get pictures of the test-fit. Here are some of the mount points getting glassed in and one of the frame brackets. There will be slight adjustability to make sure they always line up with the hood.

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[Zach34]

Can you have a barn find if it was in your barn?...

Two years of storage to accommodate a career change, family, and life in general. To be continued...

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[Rob T]

What was once lost is found....welcome back and good luck with the build.

[FFRWRX]

One thought; if you're going through the expense of using epoxy resin (which I love), you might consider using cloth rather than mat.

I realize this was posted some time ago, but it did remind me of something. I made a hardtop for my first F5 Cobra from foam/epoxy/mat. I had trouble getting the mat to lay down nicely on corners. I found out later that the binder in most mats dissolves in fibreglass resin but not epoxy. You can still use mat made for use with polyester resin when using epoxy, but it will be a bit stiffer.

[Zach34]

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Frame reverse-engineering in CAD. Work-in-progress. Incorporates modifications to the floor I already made.

[Sgt.Gator]

Zach, Great to see you back at it. Regarding the CAD design, are you designing to SCCA cage specs? For reference the latest SCCA GCR is here, the Roll Cage section starts in Section 9.4, page 95.
https://cdn.connectsites.net/user_files/scca/downloads/000/066/880/April%20-%20Updated.pdf?1680197778

[Zach34]

I am indeed toying with the idea of a complete redesign. I am not trying to disrespect FFR’s design, but they had to make a lot of compromises to make the kit affordable for guys like me. When I add up all the little things I would like to tweak on it, the clean slate option looks more attractive.

I want to have some flexibility on where I can race it. I am leaning toward time attack, but it will only be allowed in unlimited-type categories and would not be realistically competitive. Thanks for the link. I will definitely be incorporating SCCA rules into the design.