How have people found the quality of the carbon fiber parts?

[GhibliCup]

Hi,

Let me start by saying that I am a fan of FFR and have previously built a MK III before buying an 818S. I have never had a problem with the quality of the parts, until I unpacked my 818 kit this morning. As it is eye wateringly expensive to ship the kit to Western Canada (nearly $4k) I decided to get all of the parts I might need/want which included the carbon fiber splitter, diffuser, and rocker extensions. I am sending these pics to FFR as well, to see if I just had a bad batch of parts, or if my expectations are too high.

From the FFR Parts website, the parts are described as 'This street-version splitter is a high quality carbon fiber aero component for your 818S or 818R, sandwich molded by our skilled craftsmen. The top surface is finished in a clear gel-coat and requires wet sanding & clear coating for a 100 point show finish'. I read this as suggesting that the parts were made of carbon fiber, which is not the case. My parts appear to be made of fiberglass with a top skin of carbon fiber. Looking at them, I am not sure a wet sand and clear coat can make them 100 point show finish...

http://www.bairds.ca/818/Picture 809.jpg

Where I am concerned is that the carbon fiber is so thin you can see through it. Has anyone else received these parts, and if so, what was the quality?

Splitter:

http://www.bairds.ca/818/Picture 802.jpg

http://www.bairds.ca/818/Picture 807.jpg

Diffuser:

http://www.bairds.ca/818/Picture 811.jpg

http://www.bairds.ca/818/Picture 810.jpg

Rockers:

http://www.bairds.ca/818/Picture 815.jpg

http://www.bairds.ca/818/Picture 820.jpg

So am I just expecting too much for the $1,300 I paid for these parts? I'm just curious whether others have had similar / better experiences?

This being said, the rest of the kit looks fantastic and I can't wait to get started.

Cheers,

Steve

[Mechie3]

I posted elsewhere that I too was disappointed they were carbon covered fiberglass but for the price should have realized it. A shop that makes cf parts told me it's actually not right to market them as carbon fiber due to truth in advertising laws. They need to say they're glass with carbon.

My finish looks better than yours. I dont have as much see through as you do. I plan to sand the underside and put a coat of black paint t on it.

[Xusia]

My parts are similar. I've never had real carbon fiber parts, so I didn't realize what I got was poor quality. Still, I think it will look OK on the car, so I'm not particularly concerned.

[Doowop]

whoa, that looks very bad!! ouch.... I guess black paint on the bottom will make it better but that's disappointing for sure...

[Canadian818]

I wasn't overly impressed, but it was much better than that.

[Triathletedave]

I see your point on the quality of the CF parts. Very poor indeed. Certainly not up to the standards of the other FFR components. I hope FFR sees the value in replacing these parts for you. Gotta keep up their reputation for good quality at a good price. Let us know how they respond.

Good luck.

[RM1SepEx]

Your post made me go drag mine out and look at them!

I am also a fan of FFR but I'm not one of their favorite customers as I have issues with how they do some things and have attempted to resolve these issues. I don't think that any of their molded pieces are "as advertised", a NO PAINT finish. I don't think that they are really prepared for the frank discussions that occur on the forum either.

As Craig indicated these are not CF parts, they are fiberglass parts with a CF layer for appearance on the top.

I don't think that the perspective that you have used is correct to evaluate their "quality". They are intended to appear as CF with the nice weave pattern in clear resin. These parts will never be back lit as you have done to show how thin the actual CF layer is. You need to paint the backside to reduce the ability to see through the parts. After you remove back lighting you can evaluate the weave consistency, the important aspect of the CF fabric in this application. Most of the surface of these parts will never be seen when installed on the car. You need to look at how they will appear when installed.

Now after saying that... your parts are much worse than mine, I have minimal see through areas and my weave has minimal distortion in the areas that will show.

[Canadian818]

I believe it's been mentioned that they've switched to out sourcing the CF parts.

[Doowop]

what about the race wing? Anybody has one of those? that thing will not be near the ground so it will be seen at close up and it is $1500!

[EODTech87]

The wing is professionally made and is of excellent quality.

[Doowop]

great to know. thanks!!

[GhibliCup]

Okay. So today FFR have been in contact and we have resolved the issues. Joe was very helpful and came up with a solution that makes me happy again. This is why I like dealing with FFR. They had an issue, but they dealt with it quickly and professionally, and now have a happy customer again!

[JeromeS13]

What was the resolution?

[07FIREBLADE]

Same here what was the solution, i just got my carbon and they are not up to standard. I will be in touch with FFR by the end of the week about it.

[ktm]

Oh, come on now! Everyone keeps saying stuff like they sent me xxxx part and it's crap, not as advertised, or fell apart. Then there's the obligatory, post on the forum of how disappointed we are, then call FFR and they make an effort to fix an issue they knew about and shipped anyway.

At what point do we just say, they are producing a shoddy product with little quality control?

My body is not as advertised at all. It needs filler and paint and I've posted pictures elsewhere showing the defects and issues. There is absolutely no care in trying to keep the body panels defect free (yes, I have been to the factory and seen how they are produced as well as cared for) . The only response is "here's some gel coat, good luck with that..."

CF splitter? "Sure, we got one, but shhh, don't tell anyone it's really fiberglass with a layer of CF over it." If they were honest about it, it would be advertised as a fiberglass/CF product, not CF.

Adding to it, the CF pieces are sub-par and they know it, but they shipped them to you anyway.

Once Dan and Joe left the company, my experience improved tremendously on the customer service side of things.

That said, I won't buy another FFR car again. We will finish this one and be done with it.

[Triathletedave]

I'm with Steve on this. I have had a few issues, but the folks at FFR listened to me and did respond, trying their best to find a workable solution. You have to remember that this is still a craft industry, and they don't have the deep pockets that large manufacturers do. Things go wrong in every industry - it's how the company responds that defines them as good or bad. FFR is still responsive, so I'm giving them credit for the efforts.

[Mechie3]

You have to remember that this is still a craft industry, and they don't have the deep pockets that large manufacturers do. Things go wrong in every industry - it's how the company responds that defines them as good or bad. FFR is still responsive, so I'm giving them credit for the efforts.

I wonder how much money FFR would save and improve quality at the same time if they were more proactive instead of reactive. Don't get me wrong, they usually do make things right, but with all of the additional costs on shipping and sending duplicates of parts it does cut into their profit margin. I work for a large corporation and we spend quite a bit of effort on improving the front end to minimize issues later, save costs, and improve quality.

[GhibliCup]

So the resolution in my case is that as the parts should not have passed FFR's quality control process, I am returning the parts and they are going to replace them with parts that are to the required standard. They are covering shipping, and as I am not going to be building for a while, the delay is not impacting my build. At the end of the day, my view on this is quite simple. I have been looking forward to building this car for a long time, and I don't want to get fixated on one issue (that is being resolved), and lose sight of why I am doing this in the first place. From my experience building the Mk III, there will be frustrations along the way, but the sense of satisfaction at the end, and the enjoyment of driving a car on the road that you have built, makes all of these issues pale into insignificance.

I keep looking at the rendering of what it should look like once done and I can't wait!

http://www.bairds.ca/818/818%20gulf%202.jpg

Hang in there. It is all worth it in the end.

Cheers,

Steve

[K3LAG]

I got my splitter today. It looks a lot like Steve's. I'll be calling FFR tomorrow. I thought about posting pictures, but they would look pretty much just like Steve's.

Larry