5 Speed AWD to 2WD conversion question.

[keys2heaven]

I'm slotted to make a trek this weeked to look at a converted 5 speed tranny from a '04 WRX. I asked the individual about the conversion process from AWD to 2WD and this was their response:

"He is a mechanic and did it himself. Its a simple process. He removed the final drive clutch pack from the rear transfer case."

Does this sound right? Is there anything else I should ask the individual? I'd like to purchase this as the price is excellent and sounds perfect for the 818 but wanted some input from the forum first.

[MDRex]

Sounds like he removed the clutch pack from the rear diff, which is aat the rear axle. If that is the case then this tranns would be completely stock with no changes made and still setup for AWD. I may be wrong, but that's how it sounds to me from his reply.

[mn_vette]

Make sure the 2WD is really FWD and not RWD.

I'm not sure if this tranny uses clutch packs to transfer power to the rear or not.

The rear transfer case would be in the transmission, but since its an AWD transmission I'm not sure there is a real transfer case. Not like on the old chevy transfer cases that they basically used a 2wd tranny bolted a transfer case on it and make it a 4wd tranny.

[thebeerbaron]

I think mn_vette hit it on the head.

There's a box on the end of the transmission that serves as the transfer case. To do a RWD-only configuration, you replace this with a straight-through type connector (vague hand-wavey term). To do a FWD conversion, you remove this box, the add a special crown plug that sends all the power forward. There's a picture of this piece somewhere on here, probably in the STi transmission thread.

Sounds like your friend did a RWD conversion.

[keys2heaven]

I think mn_vette hit it on the head.

There's a box on the end of the transmission that serves as the transfer case. To do a RWD-only configuration, you replace this with a straight-through type connector (vague hand-wavey term). To do a FWD conversion, you remove this box, the add a special crown plug that sends all the power forward. There's a picture of this piece somewhere on here, probably in the STi transmission thread.

Sounds like your friend did a RWD conversion.

O.K. but is there a way to reverse what this person did and set it up for FWD?

Found a site that sells a subaspool which locks two shafts together for FWD. Sounds like I can still do the FWD conversion on this. Am I wrong?

http://www.subarugears.com/index_files/Instructions%20for%20fitting%20Subaspool%202WD%20l ocking%20spool.pdf

[thebeerbaron]

Yes, the subaspool or something like it will be needed for the FWD conversion. Are you planning to buy this transmission today?

I don't know enough about what this guy has done to say if the subaspool could still be used. If all he did was futz around in the transfer case, you are probably OK, but don't hold me to that. I'd look around the subaspool site to make sure. Don't pay a premium for his 2WD converted box, unless you think you can sell the converted transfer case on for a profit...

[keys2heaven]

Yes, the subaspool or something like it will be needed for the FWD conversion. Are you planning to buy this transmission today?

I don't know enough about what this guy has done to say if the subaspool could still be used. If all he did was futz around in the transfer case, you are probably OK, but don't hold me to that. I'd look around the subaspool site to make sure. Don't pay a premium for his 2WD converted box, unless you think you can sell the converted transfer case on for a profit...

Well, what he wrote me above is supposedly what he did. And supposedly, the guy who did it is a mechanic, so I hope he knows what he is doing. If all he did was remove the clutch pack, then I take it the rear transfer case is there. I should be able to pull it off and subaspool those shafts together. Of course, maybe this is what he did. I did ask the seller some additional questions based on your responses.

He's asking $500 for the transmission. Supposedly "like new" with 2500 miles. Just wants to get rid of it.

Mike

[Olimk2]

In the worst case, you resell it with a profit...

[keys2heaven]

Seller wrote me back and said previous owner (mechanic) defintely killed the RWD on this. So, sounds like he set it up from AWD to FWD. How he did remains to be seen. I take it he knows what he is doing, but seller is going to take some pics.

[Oppenheimer]

Um, are you sure this is a manual, not an automatic? Seem to recall someone saying on one of the threads here that to convert an _auto_ to FWD (to use for the 818 in MR RWD config) would involve removing some clutch pack type stuff.

[keys2heaven]

Um, are you sure this is a manual, not an automatic? Seem to recall someone saying on one of the threads here that to convert an _auto_ to FWD (to use for the 818 in MR RWD config) would involve removing some clutch pack type stuff.

It is a 5MT. Yes, manual. Here's a pic that shows inside the rear transfer case and what the mechanic did to tie the shafts together. Looks like he did the center diff mod.

http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z275/keys2heaven/DCP_3877.jpg

Here's a side view.

http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z275/keys2heaven/DCP_3873.jpg

[keys2heaven]

Question for Dave/FF. I've noticed a couple of vendors (both Australian) that sell lock-off kits for the Subaru 5-speed. The kit is comprised of a locking spool and a block off plate for the rear gear box. So, I was wondering once the '818' kit is in production, will you be looking to provide something similar as part of the kit for this build? I'd like to purchase these parts closer to home.

[BrandonDrums]

It is a 5MT. Yes, manual. Here's a pic that shows inside the rear transfer case and what the mechanic did to tie the shafts together. Looks like he did the center diff mod.

http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z275/keys2heaven/DCP_3877.jpg

Here's a side view.

http://i192.photobucket.com/albums/z275/keys2heaven/DCP_3873.jpg

I could see how a shadetree mechanic would call the rear housing that covers the center diff a transfer case.

[PhyrraM]

Considering the level of content in the other FFR I'm sure that the AWD>FWD adapter will be included in the kit.

I'm guessing, if there is enough demand, that it can be upgraded to a 6-speed adapter when the kit is ordered.

[keys2heaven]

O.K. got tranny home and part number is: TY754VC7AA-TY.

The only issue I see thus far is the transfer case. Looks like someone cut it down. I was told that someone was going to use this for a VW project, hence the center diff lock mod that I've seen on other boards.

I have no idea if or where I can get a transfer case to replace the cut down one. Any ideas?

By transfer case, I mean the housing where the center diff is located.

[thebeerbaron]

I have no idea if or where I can get a transfer case to replace the cut down one. Any ideas?

By transfer case, I mean the housing where the center diff is located.

From my reading of those Aussie sites that sell the coupler, you do not need the center diff / transfer case at all. They sell a block-off plate and I believe that takes the place of the center diff. If you go poke around on those sites, you'll find a manual somewhere that shows how all this is done. At least I think that's where I saw it. Anyhow, poke around there some more, I think you're OK as is.

[keys2heaven]

From my reading of those Aussie sites that sell the coupler, you do not need the center diff / transfer case at all. They sell a block-off plate and I believe that takes the place of the center diff. If you go poke around on those sites, you'll find a manual somewhere that shows how all this is done. At least I think that's where I saw it. Anyhow, poke around there some more, I think you're OK as is.

No, from what I saw, the "transfer case" is left in place. The rear gear set cover is what is replaced with the blocking plate. I've been searching for a couple hours now and can't see that I can get this without buying another transmission.

[thebeerbaron]

Did some digging. This is where I saw it (http://www.subarugears.com/index_files/Page497.htm), unless I'm being thick I think you're ok.

[Twinspool]

Hey Jim! Unused output drive -> PTO shaft -> Blender in the cockpit!
Sure, it'll be 1900lbs now, but who else can blend a smoothie and pass on the inside line?

[keys2heaven]

Did some digging. This is where I saw it (http://www.subarugears.com/index_files/Page497.htm), unless I'm being thick I think you're ok.

You're not being thick, but there are a couple of things on that page. First he cut the gearbox down in order to fit type 1 beetle pan, which they show how to do on that link. We don't need to do this, so a blocking plate would simply be attached to the end of what they call the 4WD gearbox and they do sell this.

For our build, what I have will work, I'll just have to have someone weld on a plate for me. Of course, this is assuming that we will be reusing the stock shift rod and its housing. If not, then I wonder is some whiz bang company will manufacture an end housing for the TY754 tranny that will allow for a shortened shift rod.

[Jmcd]

The case is retained, it contains a bearing for the shifter rod, only the rear cap/ds coupler is replaced with a flat plate.

I would question how the trans was put together, the front diff needs to be set correctly to mesh, other wise it will howl, or grenade.

[kpribbleS281]

I suppose Margarita's would be optional??

Hey Jim! Unused output drive -> PTO shaft -> Blender in the cockpit!
Sure, it'll be 1900lbs now, but who else can blend a smoothie and pass on the inside line?

[keys2heaven]

The case is retained, it contains a bearing for the shifter rod, only the rear cap/ds coupler is replaced with a flat plate.

I would question how the trans was put together, the front diff needs to be set correctly to mesh, other wise it will howl, or grenade.

The casting/housing for the shifter rod is still there (i.e. the bearing and oil seal are present). Again, looks like previous owner had every intention of putting this into type 1 beetle pan. To get it to fit, some of the case housing has to be trimmed away. I think I will be o.k., I'll just need to find someone to weld up a plate to it.

As far as the transmission, everything is stock, case has not been split open. Only thing previous owner did (aside from housing trim) was remove some pieces from center diff and weld them together to create his own locking spool.

[PhyrraM]

The casting/housing for the shifter rod is still there (i.e. the bearing and oil seal are present). Again, looks like previous owner had every intention of putting this into type 1 beetle pan. To get it to fit, some of the case housing has to be trimmed away. I think I will be o.k., I'll just need to find someone to weld up a plate to it.

As far as the transmission, everything is stock, case has not been split open. Only thing previous owner did (aside from housing trim) was remove some pieces from center diff and weld them together to create his own locking spool.

It sounds like you will be good to go with what you have.

[bu11dogg2]

you can find the center diff deletes on NASIOC.com periodically.

You could also try to find a mechanic that knows how to weld diffs.

My buddy just sold his recently:

http://newenglandsubarus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10597

One thing to consider is the WRX 5 speed is not a very strong transmission. Even with the lighter load of the 818 you will have to be careful pushing big numbers through it.

I swapped a 6speed into my WRX and plan on trying to trade it for a PPG'd 5 speed with a welded center diff.

[Calamity J]

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2162749

This thread just recently popped up on NASIOC. Some people were asking about his race car's FWD conversion (WRX transmission).

[Colvindesign]

A lot of back and forth on here..... seems someone is intent on doing the RWD only swap to his subie trans...... now if it is for a Subaru or an 818 is unclear. It seems quite obvious to me that using the WRX trans in the 818, you would WANT the FWD conversion, not the RWD conversion.

[StatGSR]

I'm guessing, if there is enough demand, that it can be upgraded to a 6-speed adapter when the kit is ordered.

Is there any word if they are going to have the space/mounts to fit the 6spd? as I'm sure you know, the 6spd is substantially larger and has differant mount points.

either way, FWD conversion kits are readily available on the interwebs for both 5 and 6spds...

[crackedcornish]

Is there any word if they are going to have the space/mounts to fit the 6spd? as I'm sure you know, the 6spd is substantially larger and has differant mount points.

either way, FWD conversion kits are readily available on the interwebs for both 5 and 6spds...

last thing I heard was that both the auto and the six speed were too large to fit into the chassis as it is constructed now....but nothing has been finalized, as far as we know

[StatGSR]

^ that's kinda what i figured.

[Cooluser23]

Will the 818 have an open differential, or will it be some sort of limited slip? (Torsen, Quaife, etc.)

[PhyrraM]

Will the 818 have an open differential, or will it be some sort of limited slip? (Torsen, Quaife, etc.)

I'm sure that nothing special will be included with the kit.

Adding one, or choosing a transmission with one, will be the discretion of the builder.