To Build or Not To Build - that is the question

[Cobraguy]

I'm not seeing the benefit of spending 20K on a kit - 20K on the engine/transmission I want, and the 5-10K paintjob to build my self when I could buy a "completed" brand new cobra for just about the same $.

I thought that buy building myself, I would be saving a significant amount of $$$ - considering all the labor would be mine?

Any advice or thoughts?

FYI - i was also looking at a backdraft racing - complete wiht a 427R engine for around 56,000 - with FFR - it's around 45-50 painted and then i have to put it all together -

[Buzz Skyline]

I don't think most people build these things to save money. The investment goes far beyond simple cash - it's the best way to invest yourself in a car.

[dallas_]

Buying used is almost surely the best bang for the buck. Plus you get to drive it right away.

[68GT500MAN]

The benefit comes from knowing that you built what you are driving. It is a sense of accomplishment that goes beyond money and you can personalize the car they way you want.
Doug

[AZPete]

Is your mindset "I have to build it" or "I get to build it"?

[Slider]

I can tell you that after a year of building the FF Mark IV, that I'm sad to see it over. Don't get me wrong... Enjoying the completed car is awesome, but I've learned so much, made some great friends (if even only through this forum) and FOREVER I'll get to say that I BUILT IT! It is a bit discouraging financially to see that the sweat equity doesn't count for much in terms of $'s, but it means a lot to me. It was difficult at times, and I even had the though of pushing it out in the driveway and putting a "take me away" sign on it a couple of times, but in the end, I wouldn't trade the experience of building the car for the luxury of writing a check and driving it the next day. I once heard that accomplishment comes from doing something difficult. To me, this was one of those things that scared me, but now, I've got a huge sense of accomplishment. As AZPete said really well, do you "Get to" or do you "Have to"... You'll enjoy the car either way. They are incredible to drive.

[dhungerf]

Build it. It will set you apart from the common folk.

Any average Joe can buy one.

[skullandbones]

I'm not seeing the benefit of spending 20K on a kit - 20K on the engine/transmission I want, and the 5-10K paintjob to build my self when I could buy a "completed" brand new cobra for just about the same $.

I thought that buy building myself, I would be saving a significant amount of $$$ - considering all the labor would be mine?

Any advice or thoughts?

FYI - i was also looking at a backdraft racing - complete wiht a 427R engine for around 56,000 - with FFR - it's around 45-50 painted and then i have to put it all together -

That's a profound thought for your first post. I feel sorry for the people who haven't thought through the process and find themselves neck deep in "kit" wondering what have I done? In some cases, they should never have done it. So saving money is not a legitimate reason for building one. You will have to come to a decision based on a much more personal need or want. Plus it will be a life changing experience if you decide to go through with it. So mulling over the should I or shouldn't I is very important. I've met people who bought one (never once intertained the idea of building), those who have had it built for them, and those who have done the build themselves. The common thread is every one of them loves their roadster. So you are on the right track. You just have to decide which is the best pathway for you. I'm still not finished but am driving it! Good luck, WEK.

[FFR5452]

Before you buy anything with a Roush engine in it, go over to the club cobra forum and do a search on the warranty and problems others are having with these engines.

[David Hodgkins]

Where are you located?

:)

[Bob Cowan]

I wouldn't consider buying one already built. To me, the build process was as much (if not more) fun than driving it. I often consider selling my car just so I can build another one. But then I'd be without a car to drive for a couple of years. I couldn't handle that.

But some people don't have the time, tools, patience, space, or skills to build their own car. Those people should buy one ready to roll. Each person is different, and should do what's right for them.

[Mesa Mike]

Why should I build it when I could always buy it? Sounds like you really don't need it.

[cobrajj]

I agree with Bob. When I finally completed mine I thought" Wow--finally finished!". Then I realized the building and learning process is over. The build is truly 1/2 the enjoyment.

[Blue MK3]

I'm not seeing the benefit of spending 20K on a kit - 20K on the engine/transmission I want, and the 5-10K paintjob to build my self when I could buy a "completed" brand new cobra for just about the same $.

I thought that buy building myself, I would be saving a significant amount of $$$ - considering all the labor would be mine?

Any advice or thoughts?



FYI - i was also looking at a backdraft racing - complete wiht a 427R engine for around 56,000 - with FFR - it's around 45-50 painted and then i have to put it all together -

Sounds like you've answered your own question.

I also debated between building and buying and ended up buying when I found a car that met (and exceeded) my requirements and was within my budget. It would have cost ~$15k more to build what I bought. If cost and time is a consideration, buy a car. Nice cars are available for ~$35k. If you want the experience, build one and pay a premium for it. But ask yourself, after reading through all the questions and problems folks have encountered on this and other forums, if you'd feel comfortable solving them. Do you have the space, time, tools, ability, and patience?

[edwardb]

Add my enthusiasm for the build process. Absolutely love driving my Mk3, but like others mentioned, was a little disappointed when it was done and the build was over. So much so I picked up a Mk4 and building and driving at the same time. The perfect combination!

Seriously though, build because it's something you want to do and are passionate about. Not only to save money. Yes there is money to be saved by buying one that's already built. But, respectfully, all parts used and build quality are not created equal. Be very careful and check everything thoroughly.

[Gumball]

Both the artist and the person who buys the finished product can see the beauty in a creative expression - be it a painting, sculpture, or some other tangible thing created by the artist's hands. But, whatever it is, it will forever contain the inspiration, heart, and soul of the artist.

Which are you?

[CraigS]

I have bought two of them. I did that because I am not a patient guy and thought the 1-1.5 year build would drive me crazy. I have been upgrading my mkII since 07 and it is now very close to what I want it to be. Now that I am retired I might consider building one because I could get it on the road in a few months. I have gotten to drive my car all this time and have done so much to it that when people ask if I built it, I now answer yes. You can get some screaming deals on used FFRs but I strongly recommend you look only at mkIVs as they are that much better.

[SStrong]

Building is a great experience. I could never buy one already built. Unless the seller has a manual with all the parts that were put into the car, you will have problems replacing parts and making repairs. Remember, these cars are really customs - different brakes, rear ends, transmissions, gauges, etc. from builder to builder, and this is one of the selling points for building one. Wiring can also be an experience to track down when you have electrical problems if you are not familiar with routing. If you do your own build, you will know to assemble a "build manual" (mine is a 4" thick 3 ring binder of instruction manuals) for repairs or to give to a new owner should you sell. Also keep your receipts ($35,882 so far, about $5,500 needed for paint and body). If you buy one, check to see if the seller has these things. I have heard mechanics will refuse to work on kit cars for this reason. You will need a good tool set and some mechanical skills, but a novice can do it. I am 1 1/2 years into my MK IV (95% done) and have really enjoyed every minute. Probably a month away from finish. Be prepared to spend a lot of time in your garage or shop though, my wife doesn't see much of me.

[cob427sc]

I bought my first kit in 1998. Followed up with another in 2001 (one of the first with a modular engine). Then I built a coupe in 2004 and followed that with an early GTM. I just finished a Mark IV. All of this time in the garage has helped me keep my sanity, as it is a stress reliever from the daily grind. The build is the best part of the entire experience.

[tirod]

I hesitate to comment because I've been taken to task before. Spending $20k on a motor and $10k on paint is exactly the problem - at those levels of expense, the builder isn't doing it, they are simply acting as a project director and paying someone else to do the labor. They are not "building" the car.

When someone builds their own motor, the costs are much less - parts and of course, machine work at a shop, which some also do themselves. Same for paint, materials and equipment can easily exceed $2,500 - the rest is labor. Or you can research it and find ways to do it far less - in the few hundreds. I'd elaborate, but the issue has frequently deteriorated into class warfare. PM me for details.

The point of the finished kits being available for $35k is that builder DID find ways to cut costs. You WON'T get a $20,000 crate motor or a $10,000 paint job from them, so the initial comparison is bogus. That's where the flaw is thinking "I might as well buy." A car with those items would likely run $65-85,000. Think about it, a $20,000 motor to you is just the same price as to them, so $20k kit + $20K motor + $10k paint = $50k, and it still needs assembling, brakes, drivetrain, etc. At the tier level of construction suggested by the engine and paint, no, not even $56k will get it. The don't get a quantity discount any more than we do. And they would also be a project manager farming out the work.

Once you move past donor level parts and let the Summit catalog start making the decisions, then the costs go up exponentially. The original intent of a kit was to do all the work yourself - that's the economic incentive, aside from earning a sense of competency and satisfaction. It's been said in a lot of other forums, anyone can buy, very few build.

We'll ignore those who insist you actually cast the block, those guys talk crazy!

[mike w]

Sounds like you've answered your own question.

I also debated between building and buying and ended up buying when I found a car that met (and exceeded) my requirements and was within my budget. It would have cost ~$15k more to build what I bought. If cost and time is a consideration, buy a car. Nice cars are available for ~$35k. If you want the experience, build one and pay a premium for it. But ask yourself, after reading through all the questions and problems folks have encountered on this and other forums, if you'd feel comfortable solving them. Do you have the space, time, tools, ability, and patience?

X 2. I also found a built car for less that $35K which allowed me to both drive and enjoy it instantly while making some changes that I wanted litle by little. It gives me the joy of driving the car while still putting my own personal touches on it. I do think of eventually building one.........probably in a couple of years as I get closer to retirement. Will have plenty of time then!

[Avalanche325]

Only build if you WANT to build. There is nothing worse than someone buying a kit and realizing that they are in over their head. If you are trying to save money, building is the wrong path. The exception to this would be if you can get your hands on a really good donor cheap.

Often, these cars are worth about what you have in them with no accounting for your time and effort. That is not too bad in the custom car world. However, a car with a $20,000 engine is not going to be worth $10,000 more than the same car with a $10,000 engine. It just doesn't work that way. Go over $12,000 on engine and transmission and you won't get much if any of it back.

There are plenty of big dollar (6 figure) hot rods that are sold for half or less of what the owner has in them. They build, win some trophys, sell, and build again. They consider loosing $50k or 100k the cost of their hobby. You can find adds all the time, "For sale $50,000, over $90,000 in receipts". How much you have in a specialty car has little to do with what you can get for the car. It is all about what someone will pay.

[unvdaveg]

A basic premise of buying anything is that "You never get what you pay for". People think that they do - but they don't. If you did get 100% for money spent then there would not be any profit (sweat equity = $ saved) in anything.
I sold my FFR1437 Mk1 back in 1999 when my wife started med school. My car was shown to about 6-7 people. Everyone tried to lowball me to buy the car. My response to them was that they didn't value me the builder or their own life since they were trusting that the car was built correctly and road worthy. Well the gent who purchased the car paid my full asking price and has been pleased with the car since...
How much value do you put into someone else building your car? Reflect on it.....Building a FFR is far more than the sum of its parts....
There's an old saying When traveling...."Enjoy the journey for more is learned during it than in reaching your destination"
Are you a destination guy or more into the journey?

My next journey has begun as I've ordered a Type 65 Coupe. I will spend approx $28K and they sell for $35K at the low end....

[mikiec]

While building mine 13 + years ago, I kept saying if I bought it I would be driving now. I took just over 3 months to build it. Would I do it again.... Nope. I enjoy driving way to much.

[GJerry]

For me the process is always the best part of the journey. You will learn so much and it will set you apart from the rest of the crowd. Even though the completed car is great fun, I was actually depressed when the project was complete.

[Scott Zackowski]

Excellent question and the right question to start with!

Those of us who build (most of us anyway) would have it no other way. You are either a "build person" or not.


For the "build person", the build is the essence of the experience. We build for the challenge, the problem solving, for the accomplishment , to learn new skills, to create, and in the end share in a brotherhood. Only a builder can truly understand the immense pride and satisfaction another builder has in their creation. It never is/was about saving money.

Search inside yourself and you will know if you are a "build person" or not and it is okay if you are not!


Mk IV, Complete kit, FFR 7304