818 Production Spy Shots!

[David Hodgkins]

I just received email from my FFR spy of 818 chassis #1(!) and some production area setup pics.

Rather than tease you guys and make you drool all over your keyboards waiting, I'm just going to toss them up right now!

Production sheetmetal:
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18075&d=1369932445

Here it is; Production chassis #1!
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18074&d=1369932443

Chassis #1 overhead:
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18073&d=1369932441

:D

[68GT500MAN]

Lot's of funny looking sheet metal on the production board!
Doug

[gwader]

I can't see any more than 3 pics. More please. Hey so are the chassis going to be delivered powder coat or painted?

[flynntuna]

[QUOTE=Hey so are the chassis going to be delivered powder coat or painted?[/QUOTE]

Not likely, the first kit going to Grass roots motorsports.

[David Hodgkins]

I'm sure the powdercoating option will be in line with their other kits...

I only received these three pic this AM. I was busy trying to re-size them and screwed up the original post. There are duplicates in my album that are ~2600 pixels wide if anyone wants to scrutinize them in detail...

:)

[David Hodgkins]

...apparently I spoke too soon. I just got an email saying I should be receiving a few more pics shortly...

:)

[David Hodgkins]

Here's a pic of Jason Levine with the 818R. Wow, this thing is LOW!

On another note, it's nice to see how accurate the original renderings were:
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18076&d=1369935838

:)

[Mechie3]

Sweetness.

[JAubin]

Didn't work...drooling anyway. Thanks for the pics! Can't wait to see some of 001 in progress! *cough* ;)

[timmy318]

:D!!!!!

[David Hodgkins]

OK, got lots of pics!

Nate (dir of ops) and Eddie (materials manager) set up and QC the 818 packaging area.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18085&d=1369941370

2nd set of production composite panels were delivered today. Three sets are due by next Tuesday, two weeks ahead of schedule.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18078&d=1369941359

Production panels is sun outside molding, some awaiting inspection.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18086&d=1369941371

Windshield surround mold released to production
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18091&d=1369941379

[David Hodgkins]

Continued...

John the Master shaper has done his best work with the 818:
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18084&d=1369941368

Master shaper John C. Readies the front splitter carbon mold for production.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18081&d=1369941364

Master welder Phil works on an ocean of laser cut steel.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18088&d=1369941374

John polishes the windshield surround
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18090&d=1369941377

[David Hodgkins]

Continued...

2 GTM's heading out today on Stewart Transport:
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18092&d=1369942441

The boys in the whse are getting ready for 818 deliveries! Chris, Dave, Paul and stewart driver Steve (L to R)
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18089&d=1369941376

Parts in the packaging area are bar-coded and inventory is predicted to be at or near 100 percent back-order free.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18082&d=1369941365

Its 80 degrees out today! Jason took new office crew Tara out in the GTM for a quick intro to Factory Five Racing!
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18083&d=1369941367

The 818 will be the first ever FFR kit to have "fastener-packs" by fastener type and part number.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18077&d=1369941358

Every pound matters. On the 818S we are building it with a smaller, lighter battery:
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18093&d=1369942771

[Wayne Presley]

Look at my parts! Or I hope they are mine!

[David Hodgkins]

And Finally...

Simple QC release, "DONE":
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18087&d=1369941373

Frankie puts the final stages of the rolling chassis together.
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18080&d=1369941363

Engineer Dan M. Fits the bodywork and headlamp assembly:
http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18079&d=1369941361


That's all I got! Looks like the guys are pulling out all the stops to be ready by Open House!

:)

[thestigwins]

It is nice to see that they are well prepared for the launch. I think its times like these that make you remember just how long FFR has been around and that they realize just how crucial a smooth product launch is. With over 200 orders in the books I can't help but feel sad. Sad that I never preordered and now I am more than a year or more out.

[JAubin]

Ooooh depowered steering rack, I like that I see Class 10.9 fasteners on that table too :) So much to oogle in those photos! White looks tight!!!

[ehansen007]

Just a general question: What is that blockoff plate on the transmission? And does it require opening the transmission and removing the output shaft?

[Xusia]

Seriously cool drool factor here, guys. Thanks FFR! :)

[Mechie3]

Just a general question: What is that blockoff plate on the transmission? And does it require opening the transmission and removing the output shaft?

The output shaft slides out without opening the trans. You will need to open the back section to install a locking spool. It's quite easy and doesn't require splitting the full trans. The tail stock unbolts, center diff slides out, locking spool slides in, plate bolts onto the back. Done!

[shim2]

Super cool pictures, if/when a coupe is available with full power windows/doors that would be HOF for sure (not that it isn't already because it is)

[ehansen007]

The output shaft slides out without opening the trans. You will need to open the back section to install a locking spool. It's quite easy and doesn't require splitting the full trans. The tail stock unbolts, center diff slides out, locking spool slides in, plate bolts onto the back. Done!

Yes, but that's not the stock cover otherwise there would be a hole for the output shaft in it right?

[Silvertop]

Yes, but that's not the stock cover otherwise there would be a hole for the output shaft in it right?

There was some discussion about this in a thread some months back. Consensus was that an appropriate cover plate would be provided in the kit. That is, of course, speculation on the forum's part, but it is consistent with FFR's system of doing things.

[AZPete]

I see that the rear deck panel is now 2 pieces like the hinged part we saw in the track photos - good. The doors are really thick - good. Steel on the footbox floors - good. No cutouts in the rear panel - good, we can cut out how we like. No holes in the front hood for clips or pins - good we can do what we like, maybe hinge it. All good! I wish I could be at the Open House but I'm committed to taking 2 boys (9 & 11) to Disney World that week. Then, a week to recover?
Pete

[Wayne Presley]

There was some discussion about this in a thread some months back. Consensus was that an appropriate cover plate would be provided in the kit. That is, of course, speculation on the forum's part, but it is consistent with FFR's system of doing things.

The 2wd conversion piece and new back plate are supplied with the kit. I'll have the new plate in my hands tomorrow for a photo shoot and installation.

[FFR-ADV]

Looking Great!

Nice detail on the headlight surround.

Cheers!

[shinn497]

gotta love it

[RM1SepEx]

important question:

what fasteners do we have to reuse from our donors and what is provided with the kit?

I've got a big box of bolts and nuts... I'm about to spring for special de-rusting media for a vibratory bowl to clean them up...

for example: are we using the old rear transverse link bolts and that long bolt through the hub carrier, trailing arm bolts, a arm aluminum rubber mount bolts, motor mount bolts etc...

Just want to know what I need to clean up vs just using new ones.

[metalmaker12]

My white/ gunmetal wheels inspiration emails, pm's, personal conversations and other forms of harassment ;) to Tony, Dave, Jim and others must have helped them choose the white for launch.

[Samiam1017]

What was FFR method for depowering the rack? Did they just loop the fluid line?

[Kalstar]

What was FFR method for depowering the rack? Did they just loop the fluid line?

Yes

[Wayne Presley]

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18093&d=1369942771


What was FFR method for depowering the rack? Did they just loop the fluid line?

See the looped fluid line in the above pic

[Samiam1017]

http://thefactoryfiveforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=18093&d=1369942771



See the looped fluid line in the above pic

So they didn't weld or any other method like in metalmakers thread? How did the steering feel to you Wayne?

[Wayne Presley]

So they didn't weld or any other method like in metalmakers thread? How did the steering feel to you Wayne?

Steering was light, precise and not once was I thinking, "powersteering would be nice".

[THE ITALIAN]

Steering was light, precise and not once was I thinking, "powersteering would be nice".
Wayne, is your roadster Power? this car should be lighter....My roadster has no power, but it is not noticeable once moving. I figure with 2 turbos and a BLOWER, your front is quite lighter during acceleration.
I know the NASA cars all have power now & they like it. Does this car really need it? and why? (an extra pump & more belt robbing power) You drove it ,let us know. I know what you said, but this extra weight needed, maybe for street guys-no weight on the front except for that extensive frame-that I really like.

[Dan Babb]

If you wanted power steering, I'll bet you could adapt Fast Freddies power setup that he sells for the roadster. I believe it uses something like the Toyota electric pump, so no extra plumbing all the way to the back of the car.

I could see using the depowered rack on a track car, but for a street car, wouldn't a true manual rack be a better option?

[Wayne Presley]

I have power in my roadster and put it in every one I do. In the 818 it is just not needed.

Dan, having driven a depowered rack and a full manual rack in the roadster vs the depowered rack in the 818, the 818 is still much lighter. To me the steering rack is a non issue and will be for 95% of the 818 drivers by the time they get 100 feet down the road.

[Wayne Presley]

I just depowered my rack, set up the cross breather from one chamber to the other and used a section of rubber fuel line that I cut off return line. Total time, 6 min including taking the pic, uploading and posting. Cost $0.

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc175/vcpinjectionpb/20130531_083930_zps41815b0b.jpg (http://s213.photobucket.com/user/vcpinjectionpb/media/20130531_083930_zps41815b0b.jpg.html)

[Xusia]

Hi Wayne, thanks for your help and expertise on this. I have a few questions, if you don't mind:
1. What year rack is that?
2. Using that method, the fluid still flows from one side to the other, right? Assuming that's the case, does it introduce noticeable resistance (to turning)?
3. Did you notice any "slop" from the lack of power steering, as discussed in the depowering threads?

[Wayne Presley]

Hi Wayne, thanks for your help and expertise on this. I have a few questions, if you don't mind:
1. What year rack is that?
2. Using that method, the fluid still flows from one side to the other, right? Assuming that's the case, does it introduce noticeable resistance (to turning)?
3. Did you notice any "slop" from the lack of power steering, as discussed in the depowering threads?

1:2002
2:fluid is drained so it's just air moving back and forth.
3: very little slop. Never noticed any in testing the R or S models at the test and they both had 06 racks

[Xusia]

2:fluid is drained so it's just air moving back and forth.

Do you foresee any future issues with the seal, since it's not lubricated?

[Wayne Presley]

Do you foresee any future issues with the seal, since it's not lubricated?
The residual fluid will lubricate the seal just fine.

[Mechie3]

Do you foresee any future issues with the seal, since it's not lubricated?

You can always cut it off.

[RM1SepEx]

press out the rack and just remove the rubber seal, you don't need to remove the piston. Then you can plug the fluid holes. I just plugged them with RTV

the rack doesn't need additional lubrication. I used grease on the end bushings. I have not tested metalmaker's modified (welded) pinion for reduced movement. I think we will find that simple de-powering like Wayne and Factory 5 did will be just fine... removing the seal will reduce effort a small amount due to less friction... tightening up the pinion valve movement makes it a bit more precise...

I'm doing it all on my 818 rack but my daughter (16 yrs, 112 lbs, flying cheerleader) does just fine with the simple drain and loop job on her 1991 Miata

wider tires will be more difficult to turn when stopped but it only takes a slight roll to make it easy to turn. You get trained to the correct process very quickly.

[EricScottZehnder]

Dan, having driven a depowered rack and a full manual rack in the roadster vs the depowered rack in the 818, the 818 is still much lighter. To me the steering rack is a non issue and will be for 95% of the 818 drivers by the time they get 100 feet down the road.

How does the 818's depowered rack compare to any powered rack from a lightweight sportscar like a Miata or S2000? I don't have much experience. I've always heard it said that, as long as you can physically handle it, depowered racks are the absolute best for road feel because there's no buffering. However, I saw a Youtube.com/drive video recently of an electric BMW race car that Matt Farah drove that didn't have power steering and he thought the steering feel was pretty vague.

[Xusia]

I can't fathom how a lack of power steering could cause vague steering. Power steering can definitely get in the way, but if you have vague steering on a manual rack, I think you have other problems somewhere.

[PhyrraM]

IIRC, certain BMWs with electric power steering use a concentric planetary gear set that moves in conjunction with the column. This used for assist, variable ratio and self-steering depending on what the computer decides to rotate or lock up. This also eliminates the traditional hydraulic assist. I can see how a manual 'conversion' can cause unforeseen issues as a direct steering wheel-to-pinion connection no longer exsists.

[flynntuna]

What ever happened to the KISS mode of thinking. LOL

[RM1SepEx]

Wow,

please sloooowly read my post...

most (90=%???) will be just fine with the looped line approach. It will be heavy at a dead stop, directly related to tire width... wider=harder to turn. As soon as you have it rolling, I mean like an inch, it will be just fine

my daughter, being small, cute, and a cheerleader (read as if she can handle it, any guy should be able to) has no problem with the simple loop job

read the depowering the rack thread, we have extensively looked at the rack and based the effort on well documented Miata rack depowering efforts. The Miata method of allowing fluid to go to each side of the rack is a bit sloppy, it rotates 1/16 of an inch or so in each direction with little to no resistance to open the orifice. You get used to it very quickly... no real issue and you have more "feel" through the wheel. They improve it further by welding the pinion spool

the 05 plus WRX uses a really neat thin diameter torsion rod to allow the slight rotation before the shaft locks tight, the rotation occurs with linear resistance, no sloppy "feel" to the orifice getting opening... however the off center rotation isn't linear, at the beginning of each change in direction as the two shafts rotate vs each other opening the PS steering fluid orifice

the racks don't use the PS fluid for lubrication. the rack has bushings at each end about 3/4 inch long. I'd assume that they are impregnated when MFG

if you remove the seal on the piston that is on the center of the rack you can reduce some of the friction in the system. No more fluid or air pressure, so you can simply seal the fittings for the pressurized PS hoses.
if you lock up the pinion assembly the steering will be more direct and linear

[Xusia]

^I'm not sure to whom are you talking with this post. I re-read the posts and I didn't get the impression anyone misunderstood what you said. I certainly understood what you meant!

I'm a bit OCD, so that tiny bit of slop will need to be dealt with in my rack, but I have a 2003 and if I recall the depowering thread correctly, that should be a lot easier to do on a 2003 rack than the 2005+ racks.

Other than that, I like Wayne's approach. It's simple, and I'm huge fan of simple. My questions to him were for own understanding, and to ensure that by following his method I knew what to expect moving forward.

[PhyrraM]

And my post was simply to explain how a BMW could end up with vague steering from depowering.

[mrvwcastner]

Wayne, do you think it would at all benefit a 818R to run a Quickrack?

I am considering it, but reality sais a waste of $1200 where not needed. I'm still considering RHD as well, but only because of diminished vision in my right eye & center mounted seat changing car class to Xmod vs. Emod (all speculation on classing at this point of course).

[bnr32jason]

Wayne, do you think it would at all benefit a 818R to run a Quickrack?

I am considering it, but reality sais a waste of $1200 where not needed. I'm still considering RHD as well, but only because of diminished vision in my right eye & center mounted seat changing car class to Xmod vs. Emod (all speculation on classing at this point of course).

Will Factory Five be offering a RHD setup for those of us who want it? Or are you wanting to do something custom?

[PhyrraM]

Will Factory Five be offering a RHD setup for those of us who want it? Or are you wanting to do something custom?

FFR has stated from the beginning this will be a world car. That was one of the reasons for choosing the Subaru drivetrain in the first place - there are sold with very little variation in many countries.

I'm sure that there will be a RHD (or even ambidextrous) version of the chassis soon after launch. The only non-chassis item I can think of that would need to be changed is the dash panel.

[Wayne Presley]

Will Factory Five be offering a RHD setup for those of us who want it? Or are you wanting to do something custom?

You would need a rack and pedal box out of a RHD subaru, and a RHD dash and from FFR The chassis is symetrical and the mounts of the rack are. If you look at the LHD subaru pedal box, you'll see that the clutch is run off a shaft to put it on the other side of the brake booster as if their original car was RHD and they modified it.

[bnr32jason]

You would need a rack and pedal box out of a RHD subaru, and a RHD dash and from FFR The chassis is symetrical and the mounts of the rack are. If you look at the LHD subaru pedal box, you'll see that the clutch is run off a shaft to put it on the other side of the brake booster as if their original car was RHD and they modified it.

Luckily I've got a quick ratio STI Spec-C RHD steering rack and the pedals from the same car. :)

[ursa5000]

That headlamp looks darn wicked, wow!

John C.'s smile tells us how proud he is of his work, A great photo than encapusulates the dedication of the entire 818 production crew.

Dave, this entire 818 saga is so gosh darn exciting---hope you took some video for a documentary....

Da Bear

[Kalstar]

Every 818 produced will be coming from this jig. Cool pic Dave let me take. I already put this pic up on my garage wall.

[JAubin]

Nice, putting that laser to work! Have to bribe someone at the open house to get their design file so I can put up a larger version of that in my garage.

[Mechie3]

Nice, putting that laser to work! Have to bribe someone at the open house to get their design file so I can put up a larger version of that in my garage.

I've made logos in solidworks by importing an image into a sketch, and then manually matching lines and splines to make it fit. I actually planned to do something like this and CNC the logo onto the back of the trans cover.

[JAubin]

Yeah that's a good way to get the data if you don't have it directly...I was thinking I might laser cut some variation of the logo onto the dash too. Maybe just FFR or just 818. I feel like I laser cut things whenever I have any excuse to. Hah.

[flytosail]

Yeah that's a good way to get the data if you don't have it directly...I was thinking I might laser cut some variation of the logo onto the dash too. Maybe just FFR or just 818. I feel like I laser cut things whenever I have any excuse to. Hah.

Reading things like this makes me glad that I do not own one of these. I would be laser cutting the crust off of my PB&J sandwiches.

Let us know when you do the transmission cover. May want to make a deal with you.

[longislandwrx]

I missed this thread... man those pics are awesome.

If you are going to cnc your own plate... maybe starting from a thicker piece of metal and adding some fins for heat transfer too?

Kind of like Perrin's rear diff cover?

18240

[RM1SepEx]

I'm a big fan of Taz, he will be lasered into my diff cover... not sure if I'll have my friend do it straight into the aluminum cover or if I powder coat it and then laser it. He's planning on setting up some neat 818 dash stuff too... he does laser and vinyl cutting, throphies etc... My dash will have laser cut switch holes and laser etched switch markings... I'm going to have something on custom made centers in my wheels too... might be another good place for Taz...

I might have to grow my beard again to look like Taz, as I did in my 20's ... a loooooooong time ago!